Missing Cash Deposit HSBC

AbbieNicole1982

I'm hoping someone can point me in the right direction on this matter. My partner deposited £865 in cash on 8th Sept 2009 into our joint Hsbc account to make our rent payment the following day. On the same day my partner deposited £165 into my sole Hsbc account for me to make my credit card payment the following day. He made 2 visits to the same branch as he's a taxi driver so went in there with the cash as soon as he'd earnt it. It was paid to a cashier who gave him stamped receipts for the amounts. He held onto the receipt for the £865 but I misplaced my receipt for £165 (as I have never kept the till receipts). I made my credit card payment the following day so had no reason to hold onto it anyway.

1st October we discovered our rent had not been paid on the 9th Sept and on viewing our accounts online, discovered that the £865 was never credited to our account. Long story short, Hsbc initially recredited it to our account and paid our overdue rent, then the branch manager claimed we'd forged the receipt so Hsbc took the money back (leaving us very overdrawn) and left us to then pursue it with the Financial Ombudsman. The branch manager had only taken over the week the deposit was made and claims that he watched all the cctv footage in a couple of hours on the evening of the 1st October (which the Police doubted he would be able to do). He refused to show us a copy of the cctv as we'd got the Financial Ombudsman involved but said that my partner was only shown visiting the branch once on the day in question. Upon speaking to a solicitor who defends people charged with theft & fraud, he tells us it is totally conceivable that the cash could be pocketed by a cashier or the manager and the cctv is easily edited now that they are all computer programme based. In his words "Why do you think so many people have got away with stealing money like this for so long? If you've got the brains and cover your tracks, you're safe".

We have continued to pursue this since (telephone calls, recorded delivery letters, etc) and yesterday received a letter from the Ombudsman finding the matter in Hsbc's favour.

Can anyone tell me who I should contact within the Police force to now investigate it? I don't see why I should have to repay nearly £1000 to Hsbc that we have already deposited, and we certainly can't afford to either!

Sorry for the essay & hope someone can help me.

Old_Wrinkly

I don't know about others, but I feel I would need the 'long story' to be able to offer anything constructive.
What printed material (statements, ATM printouts) do you have of the joint account for the period from the 8th Sept to 1st October?
I assume the bank manager is saying that the one visit (in his opinion) is to deposit the £165?
Why does the bank manager say the receipt is forged?
I don't see how the Bank (nothing to do with the manager, unless he is also the Data Protection officer) can refuse you access to the relevant parts of the CCTV coverage under a £10 official request (which ought to be reclaimable if the ultimate result is in your favour).
Why did the Ombudsman come to the conclusion they have?
Yes, things can be edited, but often not 100% successfully.
Has the 'cashier' been interviewed? in your presence?
There are many more questions, but currently insufficient data.

joelynn68

I am afraid I cannot be of assistance but sympathise with this awkward situation. Fortunately have not been in this position. I do however make sure I keep my stubbs when depositing cash, I am also old fashioned and go to the till, and have never used the tills where you deposit using the envelope and receipt method, my husband has. On the flipside I use internet banking and religiously check that payments are made and deposits noted. I am not sure which of many alternatives to running our accounts are the safest, and sure that we are at risk from whatever direction with regard to safety of our money. There is no doubt that if you allow more time on your post you will get some very detailed responses, offering proative advice that can help you. I am new here and really have no idea about what assistance you can get to pursue this further, only to empathise with you both and wish you the best in resolving this matter fairly.

The amount you mention is alot but not the point, it shouldn't have gone mssing and has caused you much distress, personally if I had had that done I would not be very calm. It may be you need to get another body involved to mediate on your behalf. I wish you luck and will look out for any replies to your problem, it, no doubt is a commonplace occurence.

joelynn68

Hi

I did find an article on the MSE site about the Financial Ombudsman, take a look on here.

AbbieNicole1982

Thanks guys for your responses. With regard to paperwork for the account concerned, we have our normal monthly statements and our receipt for £865. We don't use cash machines to withdraw money from that account as that was purely our bill account. We had no internet for 2 weeks (from the day before the deposit) but would normally check that everything was as it should be. Unfortunately when I made my credit card payment out of my personal Hsbc account the following day, I didn't have time to check the joint account. I sooo wish I had now!

We were basically just told to instruct the Ombudsman and leave it in their hands. The manager said this was why he would not release the cctv to us as the Ombudsman would request it during their investigation. I wasn't foolish enough to take the managers word for this (and bearing in mind 2 weeks had already passed by the time the error was discovered by us) so checked with the Ombudsman who confirmed that they may request it but not for a few months time. They provided me the head office number for Hsbc and I contacted them and requested by phone & in writing that they save the footage for that day.

The manager believes the receipt is forged because my partner went over the figure on the paying in slip in his own pen as the bank pen wasn't working properly. On the 1st October, after my partner had taken the receipt to the branch and Hsbc had taken the funds back, I was then contacted by the branch to go up there. They did not want my partner up there aswell, which I could not understand as it is a joint account. On going up there (at 2mths pregnant & feeling rough as anything), the manager took me into the office and proceeded to tell me that my partner had obviously lied to me and forged the receipt. He reduced me to tears and I was totally at a loss as to what to do. He provided no proof or the other half to our receipt to verify what he was saying.

It resulted in a terrible situation with my partner who then went straight up to the branch demanding answers, even going so far as to fill in a blank paying in slip in front of the manager and the counter clerk to proof he had not altered numbers on the original receipt. The counter clerk even said she believed my partner was being totally honest.

Its frustrating as we have been issued with Final Demand letters by Hsbc and I have to reply to them within the next 2 days and we don't know whether to just admit defeat and repay at £1 a month to them or to try and fight it further. I'm 4 weeks away from having my 2nd child and really could do without the stress but at the same time I feel the banks should be held accountable for these types of losses.

The Ombudsmans conclusion is based on the fact that all the till rolls and branch paperwork add up and that as far as the branch are concerned my partner only visited once that day.

If there is a member of staff who has done this or continuing to do this, how do you get a criminal investigation underway? We were also told by a cashier at our local Halifax branch that they were aware of problems at the Hsbc branch concerned. We didn't disclose which branch it was, yet they were able to hit the nail on the head! Along with a Policeman also telling us that other customers had experienced similar problems in the local area (he obviously couldn't give use exact details).

I am so angry that I am still no closer to getting justice on this matter but is it just a pointless battle??

premierfella

A few points that come to mind for me (if I were in your position):

- Both the branch manager and the ombudsman appear on the face of it to have followed standard procedure based on the information provided.

- (1) No reason I can think of why your husband cannot make a crime report to the police (but also no guarantee that they will investigate it as you hope.)

- The likelihood that bank CCTV has been altered is VERY low.

- (2) It has already been suggested that your husband should request to view the CCTV footage officially via the Data Protection route (although again this may not necessarily bring you the result you seek).

The reason I say this is that it appears your husband is unable to narrow down the time of his two visits to the branch (this is implied in your original post when you question the ability of the branch manager to review the relevant CCTV footage within the space of an evening). I do not think the bank has to allow your husband access to view the whole day's CCTV footage, only footage that he appears in (and the branch manager has indicated that they believe he only made one visit and on that basis would likely satisfy their obligation under the DPA by allowing access to your husband to view footage of that one visit).

I think (1) and (2) are probably the only options left available to you in the circumstances you describe (but will read with interest any other suggestions forthcoming from MSEers).

AbbieNicole1982

As much as it pains me to say it, I think we're just going to offer them a token £1 per month repayment and be done with it. We do feel we have been had totally by the bank but the fight seems too great against such a huge organisation & could ultimately cost us alot more in the long run.

Sometimes you just have to admit defeat and let the big wigs win I guess.

Thanks for all your comments.

joelynn68

Abbie

Congratulations on your forthcoming bundle of joy, please, do not let this overule your life. Your health and the new lifestyle you have to look forward to will keep you happy and busy. I think that if you start paying a token amount or what they seem acceptable is a positive move, and still I presume does not stop you pursuing the matter. It will at least put it in a pigeon hole and mentally have you dealing with it financially and hopefully resulting in some kind of outcome if you can find proof of the deposit. It does make me very wary of this happening. On the bank stubs at HSBC, there is no room for the account and sort code on our stubb that we take away, but I put it on anyway and they have the stamp on it. The money could go anywhere, suppose that is one reason to use the deposit counterfoils for me in future.

We have recently bought a used car under a year old and have had problems with the dealership not providing important documents and parts and adequate driveaway safety, they (banks, car dealerships and so on), leave you feeling you are stupid and nagging when all you are is a customer (not valued obviously) that wants a fair crack of the whip and expects customer service, second to none.

Just seen my interest on the total of both my husbands and mine ISAa (Cash), £20 in total. I know that the rates are low but you must be kidding me. Banks rob us blind for borrowing OUR money. It is better off in another account with interest paid net!! You deserve better treatment than this.

I wish you luck, remember, you must share the load, do abit of the emails, letter writing if it makes you feel better but do not stress, let your husband take the burdern if he says you need to just let go. Look after yourself and your soon to be new addition to the family.

That really is the most important thing, do not let this awful situation ruin this precious time for you all.

All the best