Appealing without sight of PCN?

RonFog

Coupon Mad (managed to post this!), Colchris or PTP can you help with this one please.
On 19th January 09 my daughter must have received a PCN from the LB of Barnet. I say must have because she was suffering from a particularly bad episode of chronic illness at that time and her paperwork was not in order. For some reason the car was registered to her father’s address. He says that he must have given her the NTO, but as it was during her bout of illness I don’t think he could have. Either way the matter escalated and Bailiffs were instructed. Once we had proved that was not living at her father’s address Bailiffs were cancelled and we have just received the letter below. We have never seen the original PCN, do have any right to ask for a copy over a year after the event?

Dear Miss
Traffic Management Act 2004
Penalty Charge Notice (PCN): BA…….
Thank you for your email which was received by this office on the 15/03/10 regarding the above Penalty Charge Notice.
After considering the documentary evidence you have provided I can now confirm that you were not residing at xxxxx when the Notice to Owner was issued on the 27/01/09. At the time this notice was issued I can verify that you were residing at xxxxxxx.
I have now reviewed your case and have updated our records and you shall receive a new Notice to Owner at your current address at xxxxxxx. Upon receipt of this notice you may either make payment at the statutory amount or make formal representations.
I must inform that all bailiff action has been recalled and you should no longer receive any further contact from CCS Enforcement Services Ltd regarding this matter.

Yours sincerely,

peter_the_piper

Copy both sides of the nto and host on tiny pic and put the url on here leaving off the http:// bit. Remove personal details. One of the wise ones will look at it and see if there are any flaws.
Congrats on getting it put back to nto, unusual for council to be sensible.

Coupon-mad

Glad you posted about this.

I am not an expert but read a lot of threads on here and on pepipoo.com (the motorists fightback forum where they do have expert advice).

I think you should now wait for that Notice to Owner, and as soon as it arrives take a picture of every page of it, host it on tinypic and then put a 'broken' link to the pics here for us to convert to a full link. What I mean is, you won't be able to link the full URL link to your hosted pictures because you are an MSE newbie - but you can post it minus the http:// part at the front.

In the meantime, do you know where the alleged contravention is supposed to have taken place? Can you get pictures of the lines and signs at the bay, car park or roadside where she parked, or find the place on Google Street View? If so please post pictures in the same way as I explained above.

Or can you tell us the street/car park involved if you can't find it on Google Street View - maybe we can look and find it?

Basically, as their letter says, the NTO that you are awaiting now will give your daughter the chance to pay or formally appeal. You are back to a normal stage of the appeal process (no bailiff risk at the mo but don't hang about when the NTO arrives).

If your daughter appeals when she gets the NTO, then part of that can include a request for proof of service of the PCN (CEO's photos and a copy of the relevant page of his/her notebook, and a copy of the PCN). But before sending that appeal off, do ask for advice from us and maybe on pepipoo.com as there may well be more points to appeal on (based on the pics you can show us, hopefully the Council may have made mistakes in paperwork and/or signage/lines).

Coblcris

Once the bailiffs have been invoked you need a specialist in such matters.
I have no connection with but recommend bailiiff advice online.

You need to act fast.
Keep the vehicle locked ina garage and do not open the door to any bailiff.

RonFog

Thanks all. Decided to call Barnet and spoke to agent who very helpfully told me the following. The parking violation was PCN'd (code 16), at 3.08pm on 28.12.08 in Armitage Road, NW11, as she was parked in a business permit bay. The photographs that she has sent me by email were all taken at 3.24pm. The car is shown with the ticket on the windscreen but not sure why the delay between writing the PCN and taking of the photos. I would like to post them up here but they have been sent them in the body of the email not as an attachment and I have no idea how to do this. I can cut and paste it onto a word doc but not sure if that will help, any ideas welcome.

RonFog

Coblcris wrote: »

Once the bailiffs have been invoked you need a specialist in such matters.
I have no connection with but recommend bailiiff advice online.

You need to act fast.
Keep the vehicle locked ina garage and do not open the door to any bailiff.

Sorry you have misunderstood Bailiff action is now cancelled and we are back to the NTO which is being sent today. Will post copy asa received.

Coupon-mad

RonFog wrote: »

Sorry you have misunderstood Bailiff action is now cancelled and we are back to the NTO which is being sent today. Will post copy asa received.

Maybe the NTO will carry the same pictures so you can post a pic or scan of it here then.

Is this the place?

Google maps link

Sadly the bay markings looked OK at both ends where I looked (on the Street View when you drag the little yellow man into the road and 'walk the walk')! When browsing up and down that road just now on Google maps I saw one sign near some shops which said Business Permit Holders and then much of the rest of the road was residential.



P.S. Sorry I didn't reply to your earlier pm which I have only just spotted, I would have replied by pm if I had noticed it earlier!! I do reply to pm's and am happy to receive them.

RonFog

ok thanks will try to figure something out until the NTO arrives.

Coblcris

It was an N244 ?
What date was it filed ?

There can be 'problems' with cancelled bailiffs due to the process used and the opportunism of the bailiffs.

RonFog

You know I have no idea what the order was, they agreed to cancel on 15th March, but if the Bailiffs continue to pester my very difficult ex husband I guess there is nothing I can do! Will wait until the NTO arrives and post as C-m suggests.