Incomplete HIP

Monkey_Speaks

Hi - I am buying a leasehold property. My solicitors have requested information regarding the ground rent and buildings insurance from the seller's solicitors. The seller's solicitors have informed us that they have applied to the management company for a "management pack" containing the answers to our questions. That was almost four weeks ago and we have heard nothing since.

My first question is: shouldn't the sellers have had this information already, i.e. from the word go? There seem to be spaces in the "Required Information" section of the HIP that were simply left blank. If the HIP had been completed before the house went on sale, then we would not be waiting now. My second question: is it legal for a property to be sold with an incomplete HIP?

Any help much appreciated, Rob

<sebb>

There is certain information that needs to be in from day one, and other information that can be added within 28 days. The fine for non compliance is £200 I believe. See here

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/HomeAndCommunity/BuyingAndSellingYourHome/Homeinformationpacks/DG_171802

Unfortunately many people see the HIP as a bit of a waste of time and don't put too much effort into it.

The house I had an offer in didnt have a HIP at all when I offered (although they initially lied and said they did and kept stalling me about it). When I eventually got it, it was incomplete and full of errors. My solicitor just had to ask for all the information again from their solicitors.

The vendor refused to take the property off the market until I got my survey done and I initially thought about threatening them with the lack of HIP as it was illegally being marketed anyway. In the end I decided that I didnt want to start the transaction off on the wrong footing, and just let it be. It has obviously held things up a bit which is annoying particularly as the vendor was supposedly keen for a quick sale.

The question is, if you find out that the property shouldnt have been on the market without the HIP, what are you actually going to do about it? Are you going to tell on them and potentially get them fined? Thats probably not going to help either of you with this transaction.

It's annoying no doubt, but the information should come through shortly.

Edit - I just checked the link I posted myself, and the service charges etc are only optional documents so not actually required.

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/HomeAndCommunity/BuyingAndSellingYourHome/Homeinformationpacks/DG_171824

G_M

Just to add to the above, some management companies can be very slow to respond with these packs, or request payment in advance with letters/invoices/payment going back and forth - so it can take time!

timmyt

what a great question...I hate this when acting for a buyer....yes they should ask for it as soon as possible...but it depends when they were instructed. How long did they leave it after being instructed.

So many selling lawyers - so many - send out contract papers without the management information (that CML - Council of Mortgage Lenders demand is obtained) perhaps relying on the Buyer to supply their own questionairre.

It loses the chain time.

So when selling, remind your lawyer to get this pack from the Landlord/management Agent and send it out.

The problem is, when do they request it. The selling lawyer does not want to apply for it before an offer is received, as the information can get out of date and Landlords/Management Companies do often charge for the information (and it can be very expensive, up to £300 I have had) and a repeat payment may be needed to update it.

A sensible thing is to at least send to the Buyer a copy of the questionnaire that they have sent to the management company when they send to the Buyer the contract papers. At least the Buyer knows it is pending.

All a HIP needs extra for a leasehold property is a copy of the lease, nothing more to do with lease payments etc. The Government watered down the requirements.

So often HIP companies failt to even include the lease 9as you are allowed 28 days to obatin it...and they rely on this and failt to follow up), as it can cost them up to £20 for a duplicate, if you as seller do not have a copy yourself to give to them - and often they do not ask and hope you won't realise after you've paid them for the HIP. That is annoying, and yet you've paid the HIP company to include it, and many other solicitor HIP providers will do it properly for the same fee.

Richard_Webster

The management information is not, as TimmyT says, a requirement to go in a HIP.

There is a dilemma over getting the information from managing agents. One can send one's own questionnaire to them to save time and then find that the buyer's solicitor positively insists that his questionnaire (the 90% similar questions) is answered and for some sellers that can mean another £150-£300 down the drain.

Personally I tend to appreciate seller's solicitors like TimmyT who get a questionnaire answered because if the questionnaire has been sensibly drawn up it will have asked all the questions I need the answers to anyway. Some managing agents provide a information pack (at some cost) and then charge extra for one-off questions not dealt with in their standard pack. However I ma a little windy about sending my own questionnaire out when selling for the reasons already given.

Monkey_Speaks

Hi all - thank you for your replies. I felt as though I was going mad for a while there but now I see that others share my frustrations.

Of course, it doesn't help when your estate agent is a moron...... It turns out, there is no management pack. The reason being that there is no management company. So we have been waiting four weeks for, literally, nothing. It beggers belief, it really does........

Doozergirl

To be fair to the EA, it's not really their job to know that; they can only rely on what they've been told, like you. You'd expect the vendor and therefore their solicitor to know that though :wall:

Next question is why there isn't a managing agent.

timmyt

Doozergirl wrote: »

To be fair to the EA, it's not really their job to know that; they can only rely on what they've been told, like you. You'd expect the vendor and therefore their solicitor to know that though :wall:

Next question is why there isn't a managing agent.

I agree, the EA has nothing to do with the management pack, nothing at all, and as a conveyancer myself, any claim they are is misplaced.

It just depends how early the lawyer was instructed once the offer was made - but again no lawyer applies for it until the offer has been accepted (or it could go out of date).

Any delay is the management company I am afraid, as they charge the earth but are soooooooo slow often.

<sebb>

Monkey_Speaks wrote: »

The seller's solicitors have informed us that they have applied to the management company for a "management pack" containing the answers to our questions. That was almost four weeks ago and we have heard nothing since.

Monkey_Speaks wrote: »

It turns out, there is no management pack. The reason being that there is no management company.

I agree with the others that it isnt really the EAs job to know this. However, what does bother me is that the seller's solicitor said they requested it from the management company 4 weeks ago, but there isnt one! So who did they ask? If they bothered to actually ask at all!

Richard_Webster

Originally Posted by Monkey_Speaks
It turns out, there is no management pack. The reason being that there is no management company.
I agree with the others that it isnt really the EAs job to know this. However, what does bother me is that the seller's solicitor said they requested it from the management company 4 weeks ago, but there isnt one! So who did they ask? If they bothered to actually ask at all!

If there is no management company there will be a landlord and the request would have been sent to him or to his managing agent.