pensions in marriage when one partner does not want to save

marklv

Proxy wrote: »

To think that divorce is an impossibility is naive.

It makes sense to me to plan for a possibility that might occur - after all, isn't that what financial planning is all about?

To be safe don't get married at all. Ultimate safety! Life involves taking calculated risks; you can't plan for everything.

jetta_wales

LittleMissAspie wrote: »

I disagree. I think it's foolish to assume you'll never break up with someone. Everyone who's ever got divorced felt that they would never break up, what makes me or you or the OP any different? Nothing, it can happen to all of us. Makes perfect sense to protect yourself from potential future disaster.

Actualy I knew fairly early in our marrage that it wasn't going to last forever because I knew then that I'd never realise my dreams and my happily ever after as it were. Just took a few years more to have the guts to walk away and take the chance on finding prince charming lol. I did find him though :-) Maybe I'm just being too idealistic but I would never again commit myself if I had a single doubt that it wouldn't be forever.

On a practical note though do you have children? I've got two daughters by my ex and so have used childrens bank accounts before (interest is usually rubbish) and also I've had bonds in my daughters names for circumstantial reasons at the time it was a good place to tuck a few grand away. You could possibly use this route to save in your youngest childs name and your own (but not your husbands) and thus if you split then you would have the pretence that the money is not yours or your partners it's your childs but with most accounts or bonds it's only theirs really in names sake and you can still take the full amount out before they are old enough to do so themselfes. Well they wouldn't even need to know it existed.

I only did this with 3k and only for 12 months but it did serve it's purpose.

Possibly getting into legaly dubiouse territory somewhat but there is no legal way to do it otherwise unless you get your husband to sign away his rights to any pension you start but then you would have to actualy have the 'just in-case we divorce' conversation lol not sure how well that would come across to be honest. It would effectivly be a,,,, well, postnup? A solicitor could arrange this for you I should think.

Sorry but I can't think of any other loopholes unless saving money in an account held within a different country would come under any different laws if you divorce but though it might be worth looking into I wouldn't know the foggyest about it I'm afraid.

jetta_wales

Proxy wrote: »

To think that divorce is an impossibility is naive.

It makes sense to me to plan for a possibility that might occur - after all, isn't that what financial planning is all about?

That's such a sad way to look at things. The whole point of love is that you trust the person to never hurt you and in this case take all your money. If you really do believe that it might happen then what's the point?

marklv

jetta_wales wrote: »

Actualy I knew fairly early in our marrage that it wasn't going to last forever because I knew then that I'd never realise my dreams and my happily ever after as it were. Just took a few years more to have the guts to walk away and take the chance on finding prince charming lol. I did find him though :-) Maybe I'm just being too idealistic but I would never again commit myself if I had a single doubt that it wouldn't be forever.

On a practical note though do you have children? I've got two daughters by my ex and so have used childrens bank accounts before (interest is usually rubbish) and also I've had bonds in my daughters names for circumstantial reasons at the time it was a good place to tuck a few grand away. You could possibly use this route to save in your youngest childs name and your own (but not your husbands) and thus if you split then you would have the pretence that the money is not yours or your partners it's your childs but with most accounts or bonds it's only theirs really in names sake and you can still take the full amount out before they are old enough to do so themselfes. Well they wouldn't even need to know it existed.

I only did this with 3k and only for 12 months but it did serve it's purpose.

Possibly getting into legaly dubiouse territory somewhat but there is no legal way to do it otherwise unless you get your husband to sign away his rights to any pension you start but then you would have to actualy have the 'just in-case we divorce' conversation lol not sure how well that would come across to be honest. It would effectivly be a,,,, well, postnup? A solicitor could arrange this for you I should think.

Sorry but I can't think of any other loopholes unless saving money in an account held within a different country would come under any different laws if you divorce but though it might be worth looking into I wouldn't know the foggyest about it I'm afraid.

Oh dear! Dreams, dreams. I wish people wouldn't go into marriages expecting the earth. I love my wife and she loves me, but we both married in our mid 30s and at a time when we had diplomas from the 'school of hard knocks'. Life is about reality, not romantic dreams, and marriage shouldn't be based on unrealistic expectations. We don't have children and are now really too old for this to happen, but we don't think about what might have been etc. What's the point?

My impression is that, unless there are children involved, you can divorce amicably by leaving with what you put in. In other words, split each other's finances according to what each partner contributed. In the case of my wife and I we have separate bank accounts and separate pension schemes from different employers, so the only thing to split would be the house.

SandC

If you are married then my idea of things is that you agree basically that everything is split. Of course, you might decide on retirement to go about spending your savings while your husband stays at home cos he hasn't saved - that's up to you.

Such differing attitudes towards the future should really have been discussed before embarking on marriage - shouldn't they?

I don't see what you can do except hope that you remain in love with each other - take the lifestyle issues as they come when the time comes at retirement.

Are you also in your forties? I ask that because to build up much of a nest egg for retirement you either have to be high earners able to put a lot away each month or you will have to put a high percentage of your income away for it to make any sort of retirement income.

My thought are that you have to decide whether you are prepared to share the dosh at retirement or not. Other than that, you should find out as much as you can about how much state money you will both receive, whether you will have any debts etc. and lay it all down to him just how much money will be coming in to live on when you are both not working and see if he would agree to contributing to the savings when it's all down in black and white. You could also steer him in ways which he probably won't notice as 'saving' or contributing to a pension. That is, do not take loans out, make sure that the mortgage will be paid off in full at retirement age, make sure ongoing home maintenance is ongoing so large expenditure will probably not be necessary when you have finished work etc.

marklv

I don't believe pensions should be split as they are individual financial arrangements. The house is different as it is inhabited by both partners. Of course you can probably get a leech of a lawyer who will press for a total division of assets (normally disadvantageous to the husband as he is usually the richer party). If, God forbid, that happened to me, then I woud fight tooth and nail against it - my belief is that your should leave a marriage on the basis of your financial contribution to it. Individual financial arrangements should not be relevant in this.

aliasojo

It really doesn't matter who thinks what about the morality behind the question, the situation is, as it is. For what it's worth, I completely understand your way of thinking and see no wrong in you considering your future.

OP I think the only way to safeguard any future assets would be literally to stash the cash under your mattress. (Bit tongue in cheek but you get my drift.)

I suggest you consult a professional in this field, I think this is the type of situation that requires it.

lemma1968

marklv wrote: »

I don't believe pensions should be split as they are individual financial arrangements. The house is different as it is inhabited by both partners. Of course you can probably get a leech of a lawyer who will press for a total division of assets (normally disadvantageous to the husband as he is usually the richer party). If, God forbid, that happened to me, then I woud fight tooth and nail against it - my belief is that your should leave a marriage on the basis of your financial contribution to it. Individual financial arrangements should not be relevant in this.

The law on divorce and pension sharing is evolving all the time. Its a complicated topic with no right answer to put forward. If you are in any doubt about your position, see a solicitor who specialises in family law for advice (in the area of ancillary relief).

I hope this may answer some of your questions.

https://www.pensionsadvisoryservice.org.uk/pension_rights/divorce

SAM14_3

If you are married then my idea of things is that you agree basically that everything is split. Of course, you might decide on retirement to go about spending your savings while your husband stays at home cos he hasn't saved - that's up to you.

Such differing attitudes towards the future should really have been discussed before embarking on marriage - shouldn't they?

I don't see what you can do except hope that you remain in love with each other - take the lifestyle issues as they come when the time comes at retirement.

Are you also in your forties? I ask that because to build up much of a nest egg for retirement you either have to be high earners able to put a lot away each month or you will have to put a high percentage of your income away for it to make any sort of retirement income.

My thought are that you have to decide whether you are prepared to share the dosh at retirement or not. Other than that, you should find out as much as you can about how much state money you will both receive, whether you will have any debts etc. and lay it all down to him just how much money will be coming in to live on when you are both not working and see if he would agree to contributing to the savings when it's all down in black and white. You could also steer him in ways which he probably won't notice as 'saving' or contributing to a pension. That is, do not take loans out, make sure that the mortgage will be paid off in full at retirement age, make sure ongoing home maintenance is ongoing so large expenditure will probably not be necessary when you have finished work etc.

Thanks for all your posts. I have had to log on as SAM14 now because I was having difficulties in logging on as before.Yes, I am in my forties so there isn't a lot of time to save for retirement and my only other investment is a house that I bought. You've summed up my choices pretty well - thank you for that.

I have contacted a solicitor - the answer was what I expected i.e. that whilst being married my savings are protected by being in my name, but should a divorce be needed then pensions and savings will be considered as dividable assets

PasturesNew

SAM12 wrote: »

What are my options??

For total protection .... save cash and items of value as investments ... in a secret bank vault.