Funding Masters Part Time/Career Development Loans/unemployment

anewman

I graduated in 2005 with a first in Psychology. I have applied to The University of Leeds for a Masters Part Time and been offered a place conditional on references.

My original hope when applying was to get a job to pay the fees. Now it's nearly only one month before I *have* to accept or reject the offer, it looks like this just is not going to happen.

Now it looks like what I am going to have to do is look into a Career Development Loan. Does anyone know if these would be possible to get for a part time masters course while unemployed? I read something about them being for vocational courses? I suppose I could argue this is a vocational course in terms of research and that the course is ESRC recognised as research training etc.

I have been looking for work but in the past year only managed to get 3 interviews. I have to say I feel pretty worthless really. I can't get a job I would want, or even jobs that I don't want. ASDA were having a mass recruitment for a new store opening, and rejected my application straight away with not even an interview. I feel stuck in a rut really and it seems like all I have to look forward to in the future is debts I cannot pay off, and unemployment.

I assume I am getting no luck with the type of job I would want (research assistant in psychology) because other people have experience, postgrad qualifications, or the main thing, other people come across much better in interviews. I am guessing I get rejected from the unskilled work because I am overqualified, and if I get an interview, crap at interviews.

The reason I was looking at doing the masters was to (hopefully) increase my employment prospects, but the real issue is that all employers use interviews to select employees, and I am absolutely crap at them. I wish I could change that but I can't. It feels like any job application I make is just a waste of my time and energy and even if I do get an interview, all I have to look forward to at the end of it is feeling depressed, washing my shirt, and maybe forking out from my limited amount of money to dry clean my suit.

Starting to feel rather depressed and helpless really. All I want is a job and to work for a living.

Apologies for the ranting there.

MsDelightful

Hey there don't lose hope!

The last word with jobs is really experience. If you don't have experience then you'll have to start at the bottom, cleaning, factory shifts, catering, envelope stuffing. Even in terms of 'proper' jobs like psychology research assistants your CV will look much much better with some kind of work experience of some form. More than that, even if you're good at interviews you need something to talk about! I've met so many students with the attitude that "I've done a degree, I must be intelligent, I can/deserve to do a good office job" but it doesn't work like that. They're really overestimating the need for intelligence in work, and underestimating the importance of office politics/handling responsiblity which is something you don't learn at uni (you probably learn the opposite - how to procrastinate and doing work at the last minute!)

In terms of interviews, again I think your problems are one of experience, and not being just intrinsically crap at them. Interview skills are really skills, like riding a bike or swimming, it's something you can learn. Interview skills also contain a large dose of acting and being selectively honest, which is called presenting the best of yourself. It's really not a great virtue to be good at interviews, just a necessity. The way I learned was to talk to some of my friends that were good at interviews, who got through rounds at really tough graduate recruitment schemes, get their advice, observe the way they present themselves, how they talk about their work experience and adapt it to myself. Then actually doing interviews and learning from each one.

Finally you have some practical things which you can sort out immediately. You can definately get a career development loan. The 'vocational' criteria is not strictly enforced - I did a masters in Asian Politics/History and managed to get the full loan. I suggest you apply now and stash it in a bank account, it's basically free money and will make you feel more secure financially. Meanwhile you can start your course and look for a job at your leisure. Don't be disheartened by rejections, being a student in itself can be a real disadvantage for many jobs - they just don't want someone who will inevitably leave. But on the other hand some employers really need the temporary/flexible/cheap nature of student labour, try those that specifically want students.

Good luck

Eoin_McLove

You can get CDLs for part-time postgraduate courses, yeah. You don't need a job; in fact, you're not supposed to work more than 30 hours per week (I think) because the idea is that you only take the loan if you have no other way of paying for your course and living expenses. I took out the full £8,000 CDL from Barclays for my full-time MA in Holocaust Studies this academic year, after very narrowly missing out on AHRC funding. I wouldn't worry about all this 'vocational' malarky; a postgraduate degree in any discipline advances your career prospects (usually!), so by that definition you're eligible for a CDL. Holocaust Studies certainly isn't 'vocational'! Anyway, they couldn't care less, so long as they get you into a bit of debt for the next five years.

I got a job in Sainsbury's when I started my MA last September, and this has given me an extra £4,000 overall for the year. You should be able to get a job in a supermarket; I only do 12 hours a week, and it pays my rent each month. However, it is without doubt the worst job I have ever had (and I've worked in a box-making factory), and every time I go to work, I feel like a big piece of me dies. But, as I said, it pays the rent, despite destroying me from the inside.

If you do take a CDL, use Barclays (only because I did, and I had no trouble! ) http://www.personal.barclays.co.uk/BRC1/jsp/brccontrol?task=articleFWgroup&site=pfs&value=9013&menu=4874 However, pay the loan off with a cheaper one (e.g. Northern Rock @ 5.7% cf. Barclays' CDL @ 12.9%!) when you've finished your course. You get a two-month repayment 'holiday' after you finish your course, so this gives you the chance to (i) make sure you've got a job to begin the repayments! and (ii) get a new loan to pay off the CDL before you have to start repaying. I'm scheduled to begin repayments to Barclays of £181 per month in November (over five years). I'm going to apply to Northern Rock when I begin my career in September, and should repay a much cheaper £82 per month, albeit over ten years to keep my repayments down for the next couple of years.

With regards to interviews, all I can say is that you have to have a lot of confidence in what you're saying and what you're capable of. It helps to be an arrogant git, I think. If you know you're the daddy, and you have the academic qualifications (and work experience) to prove it, then you have an aura of confidence when you go for interviews. It sounds obvious, but I think a good interview technique comes down to confidence.

Good luck.

anewman

MsDelightful wrote:

Hey there don't lose hope!

The last word with jobs is really experience. If you don't have experience then you'll have to start at the bottom, cleaning, factory shifts, catering, envelope stuffing. Even in terms of 'proper' jobs like psychology research assistants your CV will look much much better with some kind of work experience of some form.

This is one of the things that really annoys me when I look at job advertisements. Many jobs say, for example, data inputter required - must have at least 1 years experience of data inputting. What I think every single time, is how does anyone get anywhere, if noone gives anyone a chance. Yes I am limited in terms of work experience, but I do not feel this should hold me back and I feel I deserve some sort of chance to "prove" myself, and not just have people assume I am not worthwhile bothering with.

MsDelightful wrote:

In terms of interviews, again I think your problems are one of experience, and not being just intrinsically crap at them.

The last one went better than the other 2, but still no job. I am not a great verbal communicator at the best of times and the anxiety in the interviews doesn't help me. Also most jobs specifically request superb verbal communication skills, which in most cases is likely to automatically rule me out of that job.

MsDelightful wrote:

Finally you have some practical things which you can sort out immediately. You can definately get a career development loan.

Good luck

Thanks very much for the advice. I'll look into getting a career development loan.

vicki98_2

try not to get too down hearted about the job prospects. I have been in exactly the same position when i was looking for a job. I did a psychology degree and went onto study a masters to increase my chances and like you, kept failing to get interviews and felt completely worthless, but believe me it will all turn out ok in the end. Do you have any research groups at the uni that you may be able to join just to give you a little more experience when you come to search for a job. also (but you probably already know this) try looking on http://www.jobs.ac.uk and http://www.jobsgopublic.com as they often advertise research posts both full and part time (some for only 6 hours a week or less), they pay quite well and you may be able to work around your studies.

as for the CDL, i didn't apply for one as i was worried about the amount of debt i had before i even started the course and didn't want to increase it. In the end i struggled by self-funding and juggling 3 part time jobs to do so. I would definitely go for the CDL, a few people on my course (including part time students) applied and they were certainly better off than those of us who hadn't. From what i could make out (in 2003/2004) Barclays was favoured over the others

anewman

I'll make a trip to barclays then and see if I can get a form from them and see whats involved. I look on jobs.ac.uk regularly and guardian jobs but was not aware of jobsgopublic.com so I'll have a look at that Thanks very much

Eoin_McLove

anewman wrote:

I'll make a trip to barclays then and see if I can get a form from them and see whats involved. I look on jobs.ac.uk regularly and guardian jobs but was not aware of jobsgopublic.com so I'll have a look at that Thanks very much

Just go to http://www.personal.barclays.co.uk/BRC1/jsp/brccontrol?task=articleFWgroup&site=pfs&value=9013&menu=4874 and you should be able to order an information pack directly from the website, or 'phone them to request one.

If somehow you don't require a CDL, get one anyway, as I think someone else said. There's actually an article by Martin in the 'Loans & Banking' section about CDLs, which you might want to look at. He suggests that you take out the full £8,000 CDL, whack it in a high-interest savings account, and then pay the loan off as soon as your course finishes. You could earn quite a significant amount; in fact, I think Martin says that £800 can be made by using the right savings account! Sadly I didn't have that luxury - my CDL has pretty much disappeared now. :rolleyes:

Incidentally, it's worth remembering that although you can borrow up to £8,000, from this you have to pay your tuition fees. In my case, this left me with just under £5,000 to live on. My rent is £3420 a year. It wasn't enough for me to live on alone, hence the soul-destroying checkout job at Sainsbury's - a shift for which starts today at 4pm. Woo, I can't bloody wait.

anewman

Eoin_McLove wrote:

He suggests that you take out the full £8,000 CDL, whack it in a high-interest savings account, and then pay the loan off as soon as your course finishes.

So if I was to study a Masters Part time for 2 years, and the fees for this year are £1584, and likely to increase next year, could I still get a loan for £8k? or do I need to justify the amount I need? (I am guessing this will become clearer when I get the form )

melancholly

there isn't much up there at the moment, but the Association of Head of Psychology Departments has a jobs page where you sometimes get things that aren't advertised elsewhere - worth checking every now and then:
http://www.psyc.leeds.ac.uk/ahpd/

anewman

melancholly wrote:

there isn't much up there at the moment, but the Association of Head of Psychology Departments has a jobs page where you sometimes get things that aren't advertised elsewhere - worth checking every now and then:
http://www.psyc.leeds.ac.uk/ahpd/

Wow thanks very much for this.

I have been looking at various things. The bits that concern me are...

Your payments remain fixed when the loan is agreed.

You can repay the loan over a period of 12 to 60 months.

I am wondering if this means you agree when and how much you will pay back, and cannot pay back any more than that?

Eoin_McLove

anewman wrote:

So if I was to study a Masters Part time for 2 years, and the fees for this year are £1584, and likely to increase next year, could I still get a loan for £8k? or do I need to justify the amount I need? (I am guessing this will become clearer when I get the form )

As far as I'm aware, you can get a loan of up to £8,000 whether you're full- or part-time.

I had to complete a budget form when Barclays sent me the blurb; I think this was done when I had been 'provisionally accepted'. I just ensured that my total expenses came to around the £8,000 mark. I imagine that if you were stupid enough to write on your budget form that you only envisage having outgoings of £4,000 throughout your course, then they'd be reluctant to give you £8,000 if you had asked for that much.

I wouldn't worry about the application process; it's very easy to get the loan, provided you don't have about £10,000-worth of savings or something like that, of course. My girlfriend and I were both accepted by Barclays for a CDL last year without any fuss. As I said, they're more than happy to tie you into five years of debt.