Forgetting to lock a window could invalidate your insurance?

Zwicky

I recently accepted a quote from Direct Line for house and contents insurance but on receipt of the policy documents I have found that there are some pretty onerous conditions concerning alarms and locks.

To sum these up it basically says if when you go out you do not make sure all the security measures are in place you have no cover for theft.

This might sound quite reasonable at first glance but when you realize that this means that if you close all windows but fail to make sure that they are also all key locked or even if you lock all the windows but leave a window key in a position where it is visible from outside you are not covered for theft!

OK, you might say that no insurance company is going to be that pedantic but this is what the conditions say and I have checked with DL who say that they mean what they say.

Personally, I want insurance that gives me complete peace of mind. Anyone with a family will know that in the real world, despite your best efforts, there are going to be times when one of your children opens a window and closes it but forgets to lock it etc. and I do not want to have to check every window in the house every time I go out.

I know that this type of endorsement is used by many insurance companies. Don't think it does not apply to you because in the case of DL it is not mentioned in the policy document and only appears as an endorsement amongst the documents that came with the policy confirmation. Did you read all that stuff because that may be the only place you will find it.

Does anyone have any experience of this type of endorsement? Anyone had a claim refused for example because they did not comply with security reqirements?

Can anyone suggest an insurance co with a more reasonable approach to the question of security?

Andy_L

Did you receive an insurance discount for having window key locks & alarms?, you get a similiar thing with motorbike insurance if you receive a discount for approved security devices & don't use them.

Andy

trickster

Similar to what I was going to say. You generally get a discount if you have additional secutity, therefore they expect you to use them.

Otherwise what's the point in having the locks and discount if you don't use them.

I must admit though, I don't lock the windows every time I go out.

Zwicky

trickster wrote:

Similar to what I was going to say. You generally get a discount if you have additional secutity, therefore they expect you to use them.

Otherwise what's the point in having the locks and discount if you don't use them.

I must admit though, I don't lock the windows every time I go out.

Thank you Trickster and Andy for your comments.

Yes, I do get a discount for security but I asked them if they would remove the conditions if I did not take the discounts and they said no, the conditions would still apply because the contents are over £50,000.

I think that bike or car insurance is not really the same as house insurance with regard to security. When you leave you car or bike you do not need to do much to activate your security and I think that if you leave your car unlocked with the keys in it we can all agree it would not be unreasonable to expect the insurance to be invalid. Plus you are not at the mercy of what any other member of your family may or may not have done.

A house is different. As Trickster says, he does not always check his windows and I am sure this would be true for most of us. It is really a different matter to go round all the doors and windows in your house making sure all are locked and the keys out of site condition is really quite ridiculous.

I want my insurance to cover all eventualities including my own omissions or errors. In the case of car or bike insurance cover applies even if we are at fault in an accident. Yes, you can choose 3rd party only but that is your choice. I accept that my premium will be higher if I choose complete peace of mind but I want to be able to make my own choice as to what is covered and what is not.

Astaroth

But you are not talking accidental damage but theft. If you left the vehicle unlocked and someone snatched the radio from the car then you wouldnt be covered.

Personally all my windows automatically lock when they are closed and keeping keys out of sight is just common sense.

I dont think this is a particularly onerous requirement and is simple good practice. I dont need to go round checking every door and window before I leave as I simply lock them all whenever I close them.

Zwicky

Astaroth wrote:

But you are not talking accidental damage but theft. If you left the vehicle unlocked and someone snatched the radio from the car then you wouldnt be covered.

Personally all my windows automatically lock when they are closed and keeping keys out of sight is just common sense.

I dont think this is a particularly onerous requirement and is simple good practice. I dont need to go round checking every door and window before I leave as I simply lock them all whenever I close them.

I think you may have missed the point re cars and bikes v. houses.

1. My car does not have 26 opening windows.
2. I can see all the windows in my car from the drivers seat.
3. My car windows do not have seperate key locks.
4. They can all be closed from the drivers seat.
5. There is no risk that someone else in my car may have left a window unlocked without my knowledge.
6. The driver of the vehicle is the sole person in charge and can usually activate all additional security devices at the push of a button when he leaves the vehicle.

You are very lucky that your windows lock automatically when you close them although I suppose the down side of this is that you have to have access to the key every time you open one. Most windows that I have used require the use of the key to unlock and lock. I know that most people keep these keys on the widowsill for this reason and I would be interested to know where you keep your keys so that they are easily accessible when you open the window but invisible from outside the house?

I see from your last comment "I simply lock them all whenever I close them" that you do not suffer the additional complication of having other members of your household who are not so fastidious.

Astaroth

Zwicky wrote:

I see from your last comment "I simply lock them all whenever I close them" that you do not suffer the additional complication of having other members of your household who are not so fastidious.

I think that you should therefore consider yourself lucky that you have central locking/ electric windows etc on your vehicle as (whilst I do have too) a lot of people still have to check that their kids/ partner etc have remembered to lock the doors and close the windows etc.

All our windows are operated by the same key so the misses and I both have a copy on our respective keyrings and there is a spare in the bedside cabinate for the bedroom window if we cant be bothered finding where trousers/ handbags were left the night before.

Ohh... I do suffer from the other member of my household and on occasions she has left a windows open both in the house and in the car :mad:

dunstonh

This is a common issue with a number of the "direct", "cheap" companies. They often have more get out clauses and it is these which help chip off a few more pence here and there. There are other insurers that if a discount has been taken and a claim happens and discounted area hasnt been in effect (such as Alarm or window locks), they would reduce the value of any claim by the amount of the discount.

Whenever I issue quotes, if the top priced company coming out is offering discounts I always verify if the discount is worth it and the consequences of not setting the alarm or using the window locks. Sometimes the price difference between company 1 and company 2 is pence but the terms and conditions could be better with company 2.

Its easy to assume that all policies are the same but that is not the case. If you have window locks or a centrally connected alarm but dont use them, then you shouldnt take the discount and use an insurer that doesnt penalise you.

Zwicky

Astaroth wrote:

Ohh... I do suffer from the other member of my household and on occasions she has left a windows open both in the house and in the car :mad:

You make my point precisely! There is probably not one of us who has not on at least one occasion, left the house with a window open, let alone with a window not key locked or with (heaven forbid!) a window key visible from the outside. If on that one occasion you were unlucky enough to have your house burgled and vandalised you could be faced with a huge life changing loss not covered by your insurance. In this case do you really think that the punishment fits the crime?

Surely this is what good insurance is for? To offer protection for all eventualities other than deliberate negligence on our behalf. I could accept an increase in excess for example, if all security measures were not in place at the time of the theft but not the total loss of cover which these terms impose. What is worse is that I am sure that many people are not even aware of the true implications of such potentially disastrous endorsements.

oldandhappy

We have lots of windows also and find it a pain to retrieve keys some have labels for different windows as well....The window catches are very secure on there own so I think it is taking things too far to have to lock up every window every time your out. Obviously if your out all day it is no big deal to do this the once a Day but if like us we are retired and in and out for short periods normally...it is unreasonable in my view

Zwicky

dunstonh wrote:

This is a common issue with a number of the "direct", "cheap" companies. They often have more get out clauses and it is these which help chip off a few more pence here and there. There are other insurers that if a discount has been taken and the a claim happens and discounted area hasnt been in effect (such as Alarm or window locks), they would reduce the value of any claim by the amount of the discount.

Whenever I issue quotes, if the top priced company coming out is offering discounts I always verify if the discount is worth it and the consequences of not setting the alarm or using the window locks. Sometimes the price difference between company 1 and company 2 is pence but the terms and conditions could be better with company 2.

Its easy to assume that all policies are the same but that is not the case. If you have window locks or a centrally connected alarm but dont use them, then you shouldnt take the discount and use an insurer that doesnt penalise you.

Thank you Dunstonh for your comments. I agree with everything you have said. Unfortunately DL do not give the option to opt out of these discounts and in fact during the application process they are not even mentioned but I will in any case cancel this policy for this reason.

As I have pointed out in my previous posts I would prefer to pay a higher premium and get the peace of mind I expect insurance to provide. The problem for most of us (and clearly this a good reason to use an IFS!) it is not so easy to find those companies which do not impose or at least impose more reasonable penalties. I have so far identified Hiscox as one and their premiums are surprisingly not that much more than the discounters. Any pointers which you can give would be much appreciated.