Grants for new boiler

seneca

Hi everyone,
I’ve just joined this form and here’s my story, well actually it’s my Mum’s, but I thought I’d get your views on it. She applied for a warm front grant back in February because here boiler was playing up and was rather old. Her old boiler is in a utility room downstairs and she has a hot water tank in an airing cupboard upstairs in the spare bedroom. It’s quite a big cupboard and there is only room for a single bed in the room. A constant complaint when her sons/daughters come to stay with her is that the tank is always making noises in the night and when it come on in the morning it makes an almighty racket. Added to which if the room was a bit bigger, ie. the airing cupboard was removed, she could use the space for her hobby (sowing- which is currently all over the house.) I thought that if she got a new boiler put in into the utility (in place of the old boiler) she could get rid of the airing cupboard and make the room into a hobby/guest room. Then she got a visit from an engineer sent by Warm front from a company named Harland Rise. He told her the only place a new combi condenser boiler could go was in the airing cupboard upstairs, in place of the hot water tank. He said the utility room would mean the flue was too close to a window and the neighbours boundary, so that was out. The garage was a non starter because the flue would have to go through the flat roof, something his company refuses to do. He told my Mum, and her friend who was there for support, that the airing cupboard was the only place. She reluctantly said ok and signed for it. Now she has changed her mind and is thinking she would prefer not to take the grant and to pay for a boiler herself, and have it in the garage with the flue coming out of its roof. Or maybe find someone who could re-route the flue so it is not near a boundary or window. I thought the saving of £2700 was a lot to give up, but she was adamant. Now she got a letter saying the cost of the new boiler is £800 and the work is £1900. The grant would cover everything. This seems a bit cheap for a boiler, and a bit expensive for the work of fitting it in. Has anyone any experience of Harland Rise? There refusal to site the boiler somewhere else and excessive costs has made me suspicious. Are they trying a scam whereby they fit a cheap boiler and inflate their fitting fee. I know they are approved by Warm Front, but I am not impressed. Also, as she has signed for the boiler and the company says they have ordered the parts, does this mean she cannot cancel. If she could do you think Warm front would still consider her for a another grant ie. Loft insulation?
We’re in a bit of a tricky situation at the moment and don’t know what to do. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

margaretclare

Hi seneca

have a read of the previous pages in this thread. I've posted many times and I appreciate the advice of people who know what they're talking about, like Skiduck, who is a heating engineer working in this field, who should know.

We've had a quote from a local installer for approx £2,500. As I wrote yesterday, we have an engineer coming on Monday to look at what we have now/what we need/what they propose doing via the WarmFront scheme. Skiduck is the best person to tell you whether the fitting costs are expensive or otherwise, and if you google the name of the proposed boiler, you can get straight to the manufacturer's website and there will be a Customer Services phone number where you can ask questions about the boiler. They'll even send you out leaflets, brochures etc about the proposed boiler.

Your Mum is considering paying for a new boiler herself, and having it sited where she wants and not where someone wants to put it. This is exactly the position that we're in, and everything depends on what the man says when he comes on Monday. We want ours in the loft, we want a condensing combi, others who quoted us (not via WarmFront) have said it had to go on the kitchen wall where it would ruin my picture tiles, another man actually suggested the loft as the best option. Loads of space up there which wouldn't bother anybody! As you can see from page 4 of this thread, it has actually been suggested that a garage is a good place to put it - we have no garage, your Mum has.

I've never heard of Harland Rise. If your Mum is not happy with what has been proposed (insisted!) by the WarmFront installer then it is her right to kick him into touch. That may be what we end up doing - will let you know on Monday! Your Mum should then get some more quotes from other installers, preferably local ones recommended by neighbours or people she knows. It's her home after all and it's up to her what she has done with it, what gets put where. They're not dictators, these people, and just because she's applied for a grant does not take away her freedom of choice.

Best wishes

Margaret

seneca

Hi Margaret,
Apparently the company refuse to put it in the garage because the flue would have to go through a flat roof. They say they never do that. When I phoned them, they said our new boiler pack had been ordered, because my Mum signed for it, and all the paperwork had gone through. I have reassured her they cannot forceably install a new boiler even though she signed, and paid £150 excess to cover the cost (actual bill is £2850) She never mentioned that to me before and just sent the cheque off. I don't think she'll get that back if she cancels. All the same, the comapny, Harland Rise, haven't a clue and don't give out much information on the phone. I have rung and the best i can get out of them is the boiler has been ordered and that I should speak with the chap when he comes to fit it. Got a feeling that's going to be a short conversation. I know people who have had entire systems (new boiler, piping and radiators) for £4000, so it makes me think whether Warm Front are being conned by "approved" installation companies. The woman on the phone did not know the make of the boiler so couldn't research it.
A loft sounds like a good place to have the boiler fitted, unfortunatley, my Mums isn't boarded and you need a step ladder to get up into it. Also, It's not very high. Seeing as how unreasonable the assessor was, he'd probably wouldn't agree to it anyway. My whole experience of Warm Front and Harland Rise so far has been one of frustration bordering on anger. Why can't these people just listen and try to understand, instead of feigning ignorance and coming out with "er, I'm not sure." Has Warmfront got somekind of help desk or advice number, which won't tell me they don't know and I should speak to the installation people? (off to make myself a cuppa and calm down!)

margaretclare

Hi Seneca

Try WarmFront on 0800 316 6011.

My feeling would be: 'the parts have been ordered' - their problem not your Mum's. If they're installers I imagine they can use the parts elsewhere. Emotional blackmail - they think us wrinklies were born yesterday!

I've asked my DH, the technical part of this marriage, what he thinks. Keep looking!

Margaret

foxhaven

seneca wrote:

Hi everyone,
I’ve just joined this form and here’s my story, well actually it’s my Mum’s, but I thought I’d get your views on it. She applied for a warm front grant back in February because here boiler was playing up and was rather old.

The prices that have been quoted are about right for a replacement combi boiler and i don't think that the company is trying to scam your mum. There are certain restrictions about where these types of boilers can be fitted and this has obviously been pointed out. Condensing or combi boilers are very much smaller and very quiet in operation and if one were to be fitted in th same place as the old boiler then it would certainly be possible to remove the old airing cupboard because combi boilers supply immediate heat and hot water on demand and don't rely on storing water. What I would suggest is that you have a word with the company to ask if you can see a recent installation to put your mind at rest. Moreover you should be able to cancel the contract if it's with the time limit but that will be in the small print.

Hope this helps

chatty123

does anybody know if the grants available from EAGA and WARMFRONT are the same. my mum applied with eaga and was awarded £500 so the cost of the boiler is £1600 leaving her £1100 to pay.

baldelectrician

Here's a link about free central heating (for people in Scotland)

http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Topics/People/OlderPeople/Homeimprovements/Centralheating

margaretclare

Skiduck wrote:

I can't see why some engineers don't want to install it in a loft, especially a combi where you can have a remote digital room stat etc. The pipework shouldn't be an issue unless you have 15mm gas pipe running through your house, which would mean converting all but 1 metre of it to 22mm. This may be the issue some installer have - the total re-routing of pipework.

Hi all

We've just had the 2 young guys from the Chelmsford office of Intaglow, whose main office is at Royston, Herts, to do the survey. And the news is excellent.

People on here have said 'they won't do a new replacement boiler if the present one is working/is repairable'. Not true. The young guys took one look at the gas-fire, which is all that can be seen of the existing Ideal boiler/gas-fire in the fireplace, and said 'oh no, we don't repair boilers any more, not worth it, especially not back-boilers'. So that was that - on to discussion of a new condensing boiler, thereby saving us £2,700 immediately!

They went up into the loft and agreed that the west wall is the ideal spot to site the new boiler. They're now fitting Baxi condensing boilers, and it will be the combi type, which was what we wanted. We said we could get more lighting and flooring up there - no problem, they will do all that. Another cost saving!

I am not too sure at the moment whether the existing gas-fire can be left in a working condition, or disconnected. It's going to stay where it is anyway, and as we've only used the fire once or twice on the very coldest days in the depths of winter, it's not crucial. I didn't want it ripped out and a damn great hole left. Even if it's not working it can stay where it is.

We will be contacted in a couple of weeks with further details, and the installation is going to be done in the next few weeks, certainly before Christmas, we were told.

Thank goodness I wasn't too proud to ask - if you don't ask you don't get, as my DH said! And thank goodness for Attendance Allowance - without that we would never have qualified for this help.

£2,700 will now go towards our holiday next July at Niagara Falls....

I must admit, I was told so many different things, I began to wonder whether the whole thing was worth the hassle. It seemed to be that people would say whatever they thought of, 'when the moon is in the seventh house or Jupiter aligns with Mars....' You just have to get the right people who know what they're talking about.

Added to which, DH has this morning had all the staples removed from the wound in his knee and it is looking good. The District Nurse said it has healed up beautifully - given that it's the same incision in the same place, 2003, 2004 and now 2006 - and it will now be much more comfortable and he'll be able to get mobilising much better.

So, a really good day!

Best wishes to all

Margaret

margaretclare

shykins wrote:

they did leave paperwork as u say and i did tell the lady it was very old and rickety and had broken down a couple months before but she said unless its completely broken they cant do anything

I have found that this is just not true - see my post earlier today.

Margaret

downshifter98

yes this was my experience of the installers - as I mentioned in a previous post - fact is the installers are the ones that are going to profit from installing a brand new boiler arent they? Once they see that the boiler is of a certain age and condition (with encouragement from the owner!) then they will offer a new one (I explained that our boiler worked but was unreliable) - I've now been told that the total cost will be £2805 and I must provide a cheque for the excess (£105) before they will start the work - I'm quite happy with this as you can imagine!! Now waiting for them to provide an installation date......