Local Housing Allowance/Non dependents?

Glittermonkey

gardnjam wrote: »

Glitter,

Sorry I just noticed that you said he pays rent to you.
On this basis you would not be able to get Second Adult Rebate (SAR).

I explained the situation to the council and they said I could get this as there is only one adult in full time employment in the house.

Jowo_2

To be honest, I don't think the reference to a contrived tenancy by the council has been very helpful.

My understanding is that a contrived tenancy is one set up to exploit the housing benefit system and I thought this referred to live-out landlords who abused it by letting their relatives live in the property for no or low rent when employed but would then whack up the rent to the full LHA level when the tenants get benefits. Or, for example, not having any tenancy agreement just a verbal one, for example. I could be wrong though, it could be a more general term for any kind of potential abuse of the HB system by relatives.

Glittermonkey

I'm confused.

The rent was about £300 per month. He has been with me since he was 15 and when he finished full time education and started work, I calculated the rent, bills etc and divided by 3. I paid 2/3 to cover myself and my daughter and he paid the rest.

The council know he is here (they wrote to me when he turned 18 to remove my 25% discount), the landlord knows he is here, I have a teneacy agreement with my landlord that can be shown to the LHA if they wanted it.

Think I'll just call the council again and double check.

Glittermonkey

Jowo wrote: »

To be honest, I don't think the reference to a contrived tenancy by the council has been very helpful.

My understanding is that a contrived tenancy is one set up to exploit the housing benefit system and I thought this referred to live-out landlords who abused it by letting their relatives live in the property for no or low rent when employed but would then whack up the rent to the full LHA level when the tenants get benefits. Or, for example, not having any tenancy agreement just a verbal one, for example. I could be wrong though, it could be a more general term for any kind of potential abuse of the HB system by relatives.

I just spoke to the HB department to see if he could get any help or do I have to support him and this is why the contrived came from.

I dont get it, if I had a partner who lost his job we'd probably get help based on my income, but because he is family we cant?

Vixie_Pixie

Glittermonkey - if your income is below a certain amount you can claim HB for yourself and your brother would be classed as a non dependant in your claim. If its you, him and your daughter you will be entitled to 3 bed LHA rate.

however you can def claim 2AR and you would be entitled to a 25% reduction in your ctax bill

It worries me that the word "contrived" was used v flippantly! Its completely different to the situation! He is a non dep - ie an adult relative in the property on a "non commercial" basis. Thats why there are non dependant deductions! Of course if you claimed HB and he was working your NDD would be higher (max about £47 per week) but if he is on JSA usually there is a very little deduction or none at all which increases your benefit entitlement. HTH

Jowo - a contrived tenancy applies to any tenancy that has been created to take advantage of the HB scheme...

fluffymovie

Sounds like the advisor you spoke to at the council was not 100% sure of the situation.

I have taken this from direct.gov with regards to 2AR
Second Adult Rebate

You may get Second Adult Rebate if the person you share your home with is:

• not your partner or civil partner
• aged 18 or over
• not paying you rent
• not paying Council Tax themselves
• on a low income

As your brother is paying rent, you would not be eligible for 2AR. So you have been incorrectly advised.

If your income is low, you could apply for LHA and would be entitled to the 3 bed rate but they would take a Non dep deduction on the basis of his income and dependent on age

fluffymovie

Vixie_Pixie - SNAP!

Vixie_Pixie

to clarify - your brother would not be able to claim HB because what he pays you is considered to be "keep" The close relative rule is there to stop adult sons and daughters or other non dependants claiming HB for their parent's/relatives/friends keep money!

Vixie_Pixie

and not paying you rent basically means that you do not have a "commerical tenancy agreement"

the rule is unclear but keep and rent are different things in HB/CTB law

HappyMJ

It's a silly system. Your first option as his landlord is to make him homeless then the council will house him in another place and pay the rent on that other place and then to cover the £300 shortfall you have you'll have to rent a room to someone else not related to you i.e a stanger and with a daughter in house it's not something i'd want to do.

Another option is for your brother to set up a tenancy agreement directly with your landlord so that he can get the shared room rate of LHA. As it's a new agreement the council will see it as contrived so you and he will need to see housing officer at council to prove otherwise.