Question re ownership of logo - company or designer?

Fash

Hi - I run a small business and got my logo designed by the designer at a print company and used their printing service as well.

Looking around to get better deals in the current recession, I've found other printers who can do my printing for me at half at the price. When I asked the original printer for my logo he told he that he owned it and I couldn't use it without his permission and he would charge each time I wanted to use it. Is he right? I thought as I had paid him for doing it and it was my ideas he used to make up the design and I approved it that I owned it. I'm so annoyed as I can't afford to keep paying the exhorbitant charges he makes.

Would be grateful for any advice.

Thanks.

pitkin2020

Its dependant on what you agreed at the time of having it designed and whats stated in the receipt/agreement. Its certainly unusual for a designer to hold on to the rights, normally they would only have the rights for it if you hadn't paid for it.
If it were me i'd ask him to prove that he owns it. He should be able to produce a signed agreement stating that the rights remain with the designer.
If you have a paper copy of the logo i'd get another designer to vectorise it for you and give you an electronic copy of it so it can be used in future.

paulwf

As pitkin says just get someone to copy and tweak the existing logo into the format you require and take it to a new printers. Forget about the old printers, they are trying it on and are very unlikely to be keeping track of what you get printed.

Fash

Hi - thanks so much for your replies. I'll do what you suggest. I don't remember signing anything to say it was his so I'll ask him for proof and I'll get someone else to copy it.

I'm feeling a lot better thanks again!

paulwf

Not sure I would ask for proof, I would want him to just forget about your company rather than be on the look out for any printing you get done from a rival.

borders_dude

Fash wrote: »

Hi - I run a small business and got my logo designed by the designer at a print company and used their printing service as well.

Looking around to get better deals in the current recession, I've found other printers who can do my printing for me at half at the price. When I asked the original printer for my logo he told he that he owned it and I couldn't use it without his permission and he would charge each time I wanted to use it. Is he right? I thought as I had paid him for doing it and it was my ideas he used to make up the design and I approved it that I owned it. I'm so annoyed as I can't afford to keep paying the exhorbitant charges he makes.

Would be grateful for any advice.

Thanks.

Seems to me that you need to put this down to experience.

It really should have been agreed who 'owned' at the very outset and this situation wouldnt have arisen.

But you learn from your mistakes in life I suppose.

pitkin2020

paulwf wrote: »

Not sure I would ask for proof, I would want him to just forget about your company rather than be on the look out for any printing you get done from a rival.

My point was without a written agreement as to who owns the logo its irrelevant who he gets to do the future printing. If the designer does indeed own the rights he will be on the look out as the OP has already been in contact asking for the logo.
The easiest thing is just to get it redone making some minor tweaks, depends on the logo though really.

Debt_Free_Dreamer

I think Designers normally own what they design. Like previous posters have said, it depends on what you agreed. How much did you pay for the logo for example? Was it cheap? because the printing company would make money on printing costs in the future?

I belonged to a social group and one of the members designed a logo which was printed on lots of T Shirts. The member then decided he owned the logo and the comittee could not sell the T Shirts on behalf of the organsiation. The 2nd time round they did not make the same mistake. The new logo which was also designed by another member (who was a 'graphic designer' by trade), signed the logo over to the organsiation and withdrew all rights to say it was his.

OK, it's not exactly the same. But I think you might find lots of printing companies designing cheap logos for companies in order to make the money on the printing costs.

MDUK

pitkin2020 wrote: »

Its dependant on what you agreed at the time of having it designed and whats stated in the receipt/agreement. Its certainly unusual for a designer to hold on to the rights, normally they would only have the rights for it if you hadn't paid for it.
If it were me i'd ask him to prove that he owns it. He should be able to produce a signed agreement stating that the rights remain with the designer.
If you have a paper copy of the logo i'd get another designer to vectorise it for you and give you an electronic copy of it so it can be used in future.

No it's not - it is very common practice.

If you copy it (or get a competitor to copy it) and they find out you WILL have copyright issues. If the only reason you have decided to look around is because printing is cheaper elsewhere then you should tell him and give him the opportunity to revise his pricing. You can of course buy the rights to the design from him - it is really up to him what he charges. You don't have to accept of course and can negotiate.

How has service been from this company, do they design everything for you or did they just design a logo? Really cheap printers are usually that because they can't design for toffee. The finished produce is far more reliant on good design than good print.Anyone can print -not anyone can design!

if you do have problems with him i can tell you the changes you would have to make to get round copyright BUT only on the basis that you speak to him first.