Speed Cameras to get camouflaged?

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http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2-2045689,00.html

Dead_Eye_Jones

good good, always thought it was a good idea to have more and more covert speed cameras, tbh the only way people are going to take notice of their speed all the time is if people fear getting caught at any time. At the moment there is a clear message that speeding is fine, as long as there is no camera in that stretch of road.

I dont understand why people feel they have a right to speed? I hear the same old message, "but I know im in control" or "I know when its safe". Yeah funny thing is thats just what an old friend of mine used to say before losing control and killing himself and the parents of a 3 year old boy. Yeah you keep speeding and heaven help you when the worst happens. And it will.

Speed kills, and until people realise that, more cameras is the way forward. Dont like getting fined? Well dont speed! Its not rocket science. Personally I look forward to the introduction of tracking systems, an ott approach - I certainly agree, but seeing as the Clarksons of the world cant take the message on board any other way, then its the next step... if it saves the mother of my childrens life, then job done as far as im concerned.

Murphy_The_Cat

Dead_Eye_Jones wrote:

I dont understand why people feel they have a right to speed? I hear the same old message, "but I know im in control" or "I know when its safe". Yeah funny thing is thats just what an old friend of mine used to say before losing control and killing himself and the parents of a 3 year old boy. Yeah you keep speeding and heaven help you when the worst happens. And it will.

Speed kills, and until people realise that,

Why will it ?

Millions of people travel thousands upon thousands of miles every year without kinlling anyone, so why do you assert "and it wiil". Some folks will be involved in a fatal accident, but the vast, vast, vast, vast majority won't be.

and as for speed kills - no it doesn't. If it did there would be planes full of dead people flying around.
What kills is impact.

Back onto the topic.

Not for nothing are they known as Scameras.

MTC

Throbbe

Murphy_The_Cat wrote:

and as for speed kills - no it doesn't. If it did there would be planes full of dead people flying around.
What kills is impact.

Ah, but the momentum lost in the impact is dependent on speed ...

I agree that equating speed alone to safety is a dangerous move, as it undermines the message that care should be taken at all times, and not just when there is a lower speed limit/enforcement camera.

However, that aside, if you don't want to get caught breaking the speed limit, there is a failsafe way of avoiding prosecution (and I don't expect much sympathy when I inevitably do get a ticket!).

rdwarr

albertross wrote:

If they are covert, then more will die, because everyone will be staring at the speedo, instead of looking where they are going. It is common sense.

That implies that people only care how fast they're going if there may be a speed camera about. It proves the earlier points that it is bad driving that kills. Speeding, braking hard when you see a camera or a police car and being drunk at the wheel are all examples of bad driving. Anything to get bad drivers off the road has to be a bonus for the rest of us.

southernscouser

albertross wrote:

I was nearly involved in a multi-car pileup, because the car at the front realised that he was about to go through a speed camera and slammed the brakes on. The people behind slammed theirs on and some swerved into my lane. None of us were speeding.., it was all caused by an overreaction to some white lines. Fortunately no-one made contact, but it was close.

I'm sorry but it was caused by a driver who clearly wasn't paying attention not the white lines. I'm always aware of what speed I'm doing, over the legal limit or not as should every other motorist!

Murphy_The_Cat

Throbbe wrote:

Ah, but the momentum lost in the impact is dependent on speed ...

I agree that equating speed alone to safety is a dangerous move, as it undermines the message that care should be taken at all times, and not just when there is a lower speed limit/enforcement camera.

However, that aside, if you don't want to get caught breaking the speed limit, there is a failsafe way of avoiding prosecution (and I don't expect much sympathy when I inevitably do get a ticket!).

Absolutely spot on.

I enjoy a 15 mile drive to/from work each day on a combination of 30/40/50/60/70 dual carriageway roads in South Cumbria. I have been doing this drive for about 6 years now and I can confirm that on every single day, every single driver that I come across breaks the speed limit on that journey - and surprise, surprise, no death or carnage.

A little while ago, the people responsible for running the Scamerasfound a site where they could [STRIKE]gather maximum revenue[/STRIKE] prevent fatal accidents and put up a Scamere on both carriageways (in fairness to them, there have been accidents on that road, but mostly drink, incompetence, stupidity related). Now I know that it's in a 60 mph zone, the guy in front does as well, so why does the pillock 5 cars in front of me perform a near emergency stop and pull his speed down to 35 mph ? & why do other half wits go through the same performance day after day ?
The end result is accident recovery heaven as the breakdown guys attend to the accidents that the Scameras have crated ? Which is great news for the Scamera operators as they can now point out how dangerous that piece of road is - but it's them that created the bloody hazard in the first place :mad:

I along with most motorists could lose my license EVERY single day if EVERY speed limit was enforced to the absolute letter & before another poster comes on here comparing me to Pol Pot, that is because I do monitor my speed very closely and I DO know that me speed is no 40 mph when I hit the 40 mph limot from the 50 mph and that as I'm leaving the 30mph, my speed is over that as I'm entering the 40 mph - but then again, every car behind me and every car in front of me is the same.

The biggest hazrad on the roads in my part of the world is old folk (that shouldn't be driving) misjudging the traffic and pulling out into the path of other cars and lorries and killing themselves and others - but getting this menace off the roads isn't as profitable as putting up Scameras is it ?:mad:

MTC

southernscouser

albertross wrote:

Everybody speeds at some time or other... so everyone is a bad driver in your book. The amount of street furniture about, and constantly changing speed limits on a road mean that people inevitably spend more time looking at their speedo and speed limit signs than where they are going. This causes accidents.

The stats that try to justify speed cameras are misleading and simplistic. They don't look at the whole picture.

I'm assuming that was a reply to me!

Look I speed myself and have got 3 points. I'm not trying to claim I'm whiter than white.

But if you aren't aware of the speed you are doing you shouldn't be driving. It take half a second to every so often look at your speedometer or a road sign and if you have left a decent gap between you and the car in front there is no reason why you should hit them.

The idiots who slam their brakes on when they see a camera are reckless drivers as they have no idea of a) what the speed limit is on that stretch of road and b) what speed they are currently doing.

One thing about speed cameras is they show up how many crap drivers there are on the roads!

southernscouser

albertross wrote:

to do that, you must be constantly looking at the speedo, or have a very controlled foot..

No offence but yes I do have a steady foot as should all drivers. I'm not a foot to floor then slam on the brakes driver!

If someone isn't in full control of a car they shouldn't be driving!

movieman

good good, always thought it was a good idea to have more and more covert speed cameras

A speed camera that takes a picture of someone driving over the speed limit is a speed camera that's failed.

When speed cameras were introduced, we were told they'd only be used at accident blackspots where speeding resulted in a number of deaths or serious accidents. As such the cameras should be painted orange with flashing lights and surrounded by 'Speed camera ahead!' signs, to ensure that people slow down and that the camera prevents accidents: if a single driver is fined, then it's failed to do its job.

In reality, of course, they're just another way to screw money out of the law-abiding, which is precisely why the speed camera organisations want to hide them. The standard of driving on our roads is noticeably worse than it was in the pre-speed-camera era, and the safety record is no better: in fact there was a news report recently of a study showing that government figures are dramatically under-reporting the number of serious injuries on the roads when those figures are compared to hospital records.

What amazes me is that a policy can be so flawed and have failed so dismally over a decade or more, and people still demand more.

For the record, I have never had any points, so I am not the reckless driver type that usually moans about SC's because they have got hit in the pocket. I do find their existence a distraction from good driving however.

Ditto. I had a speeding ticket in 1991, which was probably deserved... not a single one since... however my driving has worsened significanly now I'm no longer allowed to drive at the safe speed for the conditions and have to spend more of my time staring at the speedometer or looking out for speed cameras than watching other road users.

movieman

But if you aren't aware of the speed you are doing you shouldn't be driving.

Nonsense: the numerical value of your speed is almost entirely irrelevant to driving safely. Someone who can judge the safe speed for the road and never looks at their speedo is far safer than someone who drives along making sure they're always 1mph under the speed limit.