Credit Agreement Wording Help!

Gareth19

Hello all. I'm new on here and I can't believe how fantastic this information on here is! Great stuff. I am wondering if anyone has any advice on my problem. It's a little involved but here's the top and bottom of it. I bought a car from Carcraft in 2000 which was financed through OnLine Finance. After a year or so I realised that I had taken on too much and could not afford the payments. After reading my agreement I voluntarily terminated the agreement. They took back the car and auctioned it. Now the wording of the agreement says "Termination - Your rights. You may end this agreement and should write to the person who receives your payments. We will then be entitled to the return of the goods and to half the total amount payable under this agreement which is £7367.80. If you have already paid this amount you will not have to pay any more". At the time I terminated the agreement I had paid around £5,800. So I assumed by the wording of the agreement I would be liable for the £1500 difference. OnLine Finace sold off the debt to Shoosmiths who maintain the wording is correct. But it makes no mention that the £7367.80 is due at the time of termination and nobody ever mentioned it to me. Now Shoosmiths are trying to say I did not voluntarily terminate because I did not pay the money when the car was returned which brings me back to the point of where exactly does it mention that I must pay it when the car is returned. It just leads you to believe you can hand the car back and be liable for only half the total amount payable minus whatever you have already paid. Am I missing something here or can anyone else see where I'm coming from? Any advice would be gratefully received!

Gareth19

I have just received a letter from Shoosmiths asking me to provide evidence that I voluntarily terminated. This will be hard to find due to the fact it was around 8 years ago! Is it up to me to prove that I voluntarily terminated the agreement or should I respond by asking them to prove I didn't? Who is the onus on here?

DarkConvict

If it was over 6 years ago (or any single period of 6 years) since you last paid or acknowledged this debt (5 years in scotland) it is statute barred anyway - http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?p=11571227#post11571227

If you know you have not even been in contact with them for over 6 years, just send them the statute barred template.

Gareth19

DarkConvict wrote: »

If it was over 6 years ago (or any single period of 6 years) since you last paid or acknowledged this debt (5 years in scotland) it is statute barred anyway -

If you know you have not even been in contact with them for over 6 years, just send them the statute barred template.

I have been paying them £10 per month. I'm not disputing the fact it's my debt. What I'm disputing is the balance they say I owe. They say I didn't voluntarily terminate therefore I owe the total amount of the CCA minus what I have paid. I know I did terminate voluntarily meaning I owe 50% of the total amount of the CCA minus what I have paid. They are now saying I need to provide evidence that I voluntarily terminated after all this time. Surely I could turn it around to them and tell them to prove I didn't???

DarkConvict

It is upto the DCA to prove the debt and keep accurate records. The problem will be if the DCA has records indicating it was not voluntary you would need to prove against that. You could argue that after 6 years you had no need to keep any records of it, but i don't know how to proceed. It might be worth sending the original car company a SAR - http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showpost.html?p=11753093&postcount=9 . If you signed off on it voluntarily, they should have that paperwork.

As to the £10 a month, was this 6 years or later since you last spoke to your original creditor?

Gareth19

DarkConvict wrote: »

As to the £10 a month, was this 6 years or later since you last spoke to your original creditor?

No I have paid up until quite recently.

DarkConvict

Fair enough. It was just a thought.

I would therefore SAR the original car lender to get proof from them the car was handed back.

Gareth19

DarkConvict wrote: »

Fair enough. It was just a thought.

I would therefore SAR the original car lender to get proof from them the car was handed back.

Thanks for the advice. I feel this could get quite messy because if the company no longer exists and has apparantly been taken over so the chances of a letter going missing is very high after this time. If they turn around and have no letter and I say I wrote one then it will just be one word against another. I'll give it a try though

Gareth19

Almost 8 yeard after I took out the HP they have written back and are now saying I did not voluntary terminate. Instead I voluntary surrendered (which I'd never even heard of). The only 2 options on the CCA was repossession or termination. I've searched around and it seems this is quite common when they try to say you surrendered rather than terminated as when you surrender you are still liable for the full debt.

Any advice on what my reply to this letter should be??

JamieT1977

I think its in their field to prove their case not for you to defend yours. So if they have proof to back up their claims then fair enough, but doubt they have, especially as you mentioned the company takeover, makes it even less likely they have any proof.

Gareth19

I have found the original letter I wrote to terminate back in 2002 stored on my father's computer. However I am not sure how much weight this would hold in court as in todays age of computers they can say I could have just typed it up now. I don't see how they can say I voluntarily surrendered when that option wasn;t even on the CCA therefore I'd never heard of it. A nice day out in court coming up I feel