Are most people in debt to there eye balls?

SingleSue

When I was working, there were quite a few who used to moan about the fact we could afford to go on holiday every year and blamed the fact we could get tax credits (this was at the time when we could get tax credits, our combined earnings eventually took us past this).

The truth was that our holidays cost less than £500 a year (2 weeks in a caravan), we have never had a new kitchen (my current one cost £50 from the local paper in 1998), had one cheap sofa suite in 20 years (cost £399) and never used credit cards or finance and were very careful with our money. In fact, we could have afforded for me not to work at all.

They on the other hand, had loans and finance for 10k kitchens, brand new cars, extensions, huge and expensive conservatories, sofa suites for 5 or 6k which they changed every 2 years, expensive clothes and were still paying back for the 8k holiday the year before...the wives had to work to afford to pay the credit they had taken out although the husbands on their own were earning way more than we were combined including tax credits.

ms_london

bathgatebuyer wrote: »

I'm paying as additional contributions to my mortgage so it will be all gone by the time I'm 46. I bought my first place when I was 21 and so have always been focused about just getting my own roof over my head. Yes, some people think I'm a dullard as I rarely go abroad, but in terms of wealth, I'm probably actually quite lucky by comparison. I know these guys sometimes look down on me from their big fancy homes and stuff that they share with their partners, but everything I have in life, I've earned myself. Once that roof is over my head and completely paid off, I'll feel like the wealthiest person alive!!!

:T:T:T

I admire your attitude and going for it alone. It is near impossible nowadays but it can be done if you put in the hard work and effort, like you have done. It saddens me when people are in relationships because they can't afford to stand on their own two feet, and I would love the feeling of achievement knowing the home I am living in is mine, and down to my hard work and sacrifice.

There are so many inspirational people on MSE, and I know a lot of people on here have had a god awful time this year, so here is wishing you all, all the best for 2010.

I also agree with:

"We are not responsible for the hand we are dealt.
We are responsible for the way we play it."

Happy New Year xx

*Vikki*

computershack wrote: »

Warning, long post:



Oh thanks. So according to you, I'm either lying or I'm a thief?

My scenario:
Wife, 2 kids.
Total joint income including all tax credits is £20k.

We're on a 10 year mortgage (was 25 but payments were so ridiculously low - would now be £125 a month - we decided to change to a 10 year to get shut of it), own and run two cars (Mine is 4 year old Mondeo Ghia, wifes is a Mitsubishi FTO sports car), have all the latest consoles with at least 10 games for each, 3 good spec laptops, 3x flat screen tellies, internet, Sky HD. We have a family holiday abroad every year and the wife goes with the kids on one as well which we also pay for. We contribute £25 a month to each kids savings accounts as well as the pocket money they get. I have £3k in my ISA (was more but I bought a Capri and funded my new business), no idea what the wife has in hers, the joint account is never less than £500 in credit and the joint credit cards are paid off in full every month. Any big bill that comes along (just had a new uPVC front door a month ago at a cost of £610) is paid for in full in cash.

So according to you either:
A)We're up to our eyeballs in debt (yet the bank and CC balances say otherwise)
My wife is the big earner (yet she only does 20hrs a week at £8.50/hr)
C) We're doing something dodgy (which I take great offence to)

THE REALITY IS:

• We bought our house before the prices went stupid and we've stayed put. Our house is worth five times what we paid for it to give you an idea how much its risen and how cheap it was back then. 2003 was about the last time it was realistically affordable to buy a house. Once a 3x joint income mortgage wasn't sufficient, they were too expensive. I'd not entertain buying one now nor recommend someone does. It gets decorated when it needs to and a new kitchen bought when it needs to, not just because we want to change the colour. When we do buy stuff for it, we buy the best quality we can. We've got carpets that are several years old but still look extremely good because we bought decent ones. Cheap doesn't always work out cost effective in the long run.
• The cars weren't new when bought. They're serviced to the recommended schedules and all repairs done when needed, rather than being left which usually costs more. Things like RAC is paid out of Tesco Clubcard points. We make maximum use of cashback and screen scrapers so we both get insured for under £200 a year. WE WALK when going anywhere in town (its only small) unless its the weekly shop. I manage 55MPG out of mine because I can actually drive properly. I think the wife said she gets 36MPG out of hers which isn't bad for a 2L V6 sports car. Neither of us are slow drivers.
• We repair rather than replace. I've self taught myself to fix a lot of things over the years. It simply requires confidence, some decent guidance (internet is stuffed full) and the right tools. For example, the vacuum cleaner has died three times now. Completely stone cold dead. Every time without fail it has been a break in the mains cable where it enters the vacuum cleaner. So, take it to bits, out with the pliers, cut it back 6 inches, bare the wires and solder them where the originals went and its good to go again. OK, so the mains lead is now 18" shorter than it was originally but its still over 30ft long. What would you do, go buy another?
• Two consoles were bought as presents by family, the PS3 from someone who was skint, although it was far from a giveaway price. Games are bought as presents, in the sales or on Ebay usually a month or two after release when they're cheaper.
• Laptops are ex-display ones I bought at clearance auctions as are the TVs.
• Holidays abroad are paid for with Tesco Clubcard vouchers so we only really have to find spending money. That saves us £1000 a year or more just there.
• Credit card is a cashback one. It means that petrol/diesel, if we get it from a supermarket, is effectively 9p a gallon cheaper than the pump price after the cashback. All spending is done on it so we get around £20-30 a month average cashback. There's only one month in every year (no idea but its been the same month) where it doesn't get paid off in full but the cashback outweighs the interest.
• We don't run our house at 25C in winter. Its well insulated and its not lit up like Blackpool Illuminations unlike my brother who feels the need to have every room lit on a night. As a result, our energy bills combined are just over £700 a year. Boiler is still the original back boiler fitted in 1984. Sure it uses more gas than a new combi-boiler but importantly it has never broken down and the savings in gas are more than outweighed by the cost of replacement or repairs of the replacement.
• Everything that is to be replaced gets sold to partially fund its replacement. Nothing working goes in the tip.
• When it comes to Xmas, nobody in our family buys for adults other than a card. All of us have no idea !!!!!! we want anyway and pretty much have everything that could be deemed to be reasonable to buy so we don't bother. Instead, we get things for the kids in the family. As a result, they get more than they would've.

And thats it or some of it. No real secret. YET NONE OF IT IS VISIBLE TO THE OUTSIDE OBSERVER LIKE YOURSELF. How are you to know my holiday was paid for by Tesco for example? It'd be the same one you're on if you were at the same place but you'd have paid £500 or whatever so automatically assume that I did or a similar amount but I bet you'd never guess FREE as a cost.

Decide if you actually want something eg I saw a lovely Denon Home Theatre amplifier in Richer Sounds yesterday and I'd like to change the one I've got because its run out of inputs but I came home without it because I don't truly really need one yet. When you do buy be careful what you buy, where you buy from and be creative in how you pay (for example using Tesco Clubcard points or a cashback credit card or website). Don't always buy new - all those laptopsand the TVs were under 4 months old, still had all the protective plastics on and cost me half what their retail value was. Learn how things work and fix what you've got instead of paying through the nose to replace or get a trade out to do a simple job. Things like basic plumbing aren't rocket science - anyone can change a tap washer or replace a ballcock.

There's an absolute ton of other stuff the wife and I do but it means that we can make our money stretch just as far as someone who has twice the income but does little or no moneysaving at all. I go back to my brother who is the complete opposite. He and his wife earn £52k between them, over two times what we do. He bought his house just 5 years after we did but paid four times the price for a similar house due to the rises. Not an extravagent lifestyle but incredibly wasteful. All the lights on on a night time, heating up full, the food they bin is incredible. Kids have more clothes than its possible to wear - I swear some of them just don't get used and others a days use before they're thrown out for being too small. Just before Xmas he wrote his car off and needs to get another which apparently I'm going to be helping him find. Because he's done sod all money saving, he's got just £500 to get something taxed and MOT'd that can reliably do a 180 mile motorway round trip 3 times a week and finance is apparently out. I'm good but not that good...

What credit card do you have? I'd love one that gives me back that in cash back making fuel that cheap

btw love the post, and as been said very inspirational posts on here

mrscmr

Hi, just wanted to add my perspective...

You can never just a book by its cover.... never envy people, never assume that they live their lives a certain way, earn a certain amount and all is roses around the door. sometimes it is and sometimes it isnt.

circumstances come along for good and bad...

would you look at me and my family and what would u see? nice house, cars, kids at private school, successful people and you would feel maybe you want to be like us? and the reality is .... you wouldnt, really wouldnt.

we were greedy, had too much, wasted it, were ungrateful until it went wrong and OH's business collapse and other issues which mean combined with the global recession our little balancing act.. just collapsed :-(

but we fight on the good fight and a year on we are stronger and more focused that ever.

so to the original poster... I say this: tomorrow is a new year and a new start. live life for u and focus on u and ur family and goals... dont try to work people out and assume they live one way or another becos you will most likely be wrong.

i wish you a happy and successful 2010!

property.advert

When I was married, someone looking at my wife's lifestyle would say the same. I earned a good six figure salary and she earned around 25k. We lived in a place she could never have afforded, ate out at expensive restaurants, have all the fine things in life and had numerous exotic holidays. She had a partner with a much higher income.

bathgatebuyer

ms_london wrote: »

I admire your attitude and going for it alone. It is near impossible nowadays but it can be done if you put in the hard work and effort, like you have done. It saddens me when people are in relationships because they can't afford to stand on their own two feet, and I would love the feeling of achievement knowing the home I am living in is mine, and down to my hard work and sacrifice.

It's not through choice that I'm on my own - really would quite like someone to share my life with, but I'm not going to put my life on hold until that happens (if it happens!)

I suppose it's always been part of my psyche that I would stand on my own two feet. My parents separated when I was very young and my Mum brought me up on her own from when I was about 3 with no financial help from my Dad. For me, life is about looking after yourself and not being reliant on any man for the food that's put on your table or the roof over your head. Not that I'm some sort of bra-burning man-hater, of course, but I'm not willing to put my own life and finances on hold until some man comes along to do these things for me or with me. That's the reason I chose the profession I'm in and worked hard for many years to qualify. Even from school, owning my own place was really one of my biggest ambitions. I wanted to come out at night from work and being able to live somewhere nice, surrounded by nice things. (Thatcher's child, eh?!)

Of course it's difficult seeing people jet off on holidays a few times a year while I really have to save and save just for a small break, but my situation is different to theirs as they all live in two income houses. I'm the youngest person in my block of apartments. I'm also the only single one. It's unbelievable to some of my neighbours that I can afford to live here on one income and I've even had someone ask if I got help from my parents for a deposit :rolleyes: such was their disbelief (and of course I didn't! I wouldn't ask my Mum for anything given all that she's had to bear financially while I was growing up).

When I've been out of work, it's been really hard as there's no one there to help take the strain and you do feel VERY exposed when you're on your own and unemployed both financially and emotionally, but I do take an immense amount of pride in where I stay and the fact that it is all mine. I just need to focus my mind on getting my mortgage down now that the majority of my debts are away (debts that were incurred when I was unemployed) and I'm sure that if I really set my mind to it, they could be gone by the time I'm 40!

Those who have laughed at me in the past for my non-designer clothes and my occasional weekend away in Liverpool while they jet off to the other side of the world have to remember that their situation - as with all of ours - could change. They base who they are completely on two incomes - what happens if they separate and divorce? What will they have to fall back on?

I guess I learnt very hard from growing up in a single parent household that you have to make plans to look after yourself as there might not always be someone there to do that for you.

ms_london

bathgatebuyer wrote: »

It's not through choice that I'm on my own - really would quite like someone to share my life with, but I'm not going to put my life on hold until that happens (if it happens!)

I suppose it's always been part of my psyche that I would stand on my own two feet. My parents separated when I was very young and my Mum brought me up on her own from when I was about 3 with no financial help from my Dad. For me, life is about looking after yourself and not being reliant on any man for the food that's put on your table or the roof over your head. Not that I'm some sort of bra-burning man-hater, of course, but I'm not willing to put my own life and finances on hold until some man comes along to do these things for me or with me. That's the reason I chose the profession I'm in and worked hard for many years to qualify. Even from school, owning my own place was really one of my biggest ambitions. I wanted to come out at night from work and being able to live somewhere nice, surrounded by nice things. (Thatcher's child, eh?!)
.

I agree with everything you have written, infact, it could have been written by me.

Unfortunately I've been a bit of a late starter, got into massive debt, paid it off, went travelling for two years (working of course!), and now I am back, hit the recession, ended up in a bit more debt, but my next goal is to save for a house deposit and buy my own place. It will be a struggle, but so worth it, for every reason you listed.

Sounds like we've had similiar upbringings. Like you, I want to know I can do it on my own, not rely on someone else for my happiness. I know lots of people who are in relationships because they can't afford not to be, and that is really sad - and I really feel for people in that situation. Of course, I am generalising, but I guess I am too independent for my own good - probably why I am still single. :rolleyes:

Happy New Year.

xx

computershack

*Vikki* wrote: »

What credit card do you have? I'd love one that gives me back that in cash back making fuel that cheap

btw love the post, and as been said very inspirational posts on here

Barclaycard Platinum cashback. It is at 0.5% on all spending and an additional 1.5% on supermarket/petrol - definitely additional as the 0.5% cashback is 0.5% of the total debits for that month. Looking on their site, it would appear to be no longer offered.