Urgent regarding jobseekers allowance and forced resignation - pls help..

alsimmons_8

Hi all,

This is a very sensitive matter for me as I have not told many people the truth as it is quite embarassing. I was forced to resign from my company as I breached contract in my employment for computer usage but due to my otherwise good work ethic the company has decided to ask me to resign on my own accord and they will give me a reference and no one will no the reason of my resignation apart from "personal reasons".

I claimed jobseekers allowance and I am geniunely looking for another job and it has been 2 weeks since my resignation. The claim has gone through but now they have sent me an ES86LV form and ES461LV form saying they contacted my company who in turn said I left voluntarily and thus they are asking me to outline why I left and if I had actively seeked employment before leaving. Now I am trying to keep it a personal matter as I do not want everyone knowing that I was essentially sacked. Hence I was wondering what the implications would be if I were to either not disclose on the form why I left (which is an option on the form) - ie will that stop my jobseekers allowance? Or I was going to say that "I had a family member who was ill/needed care but since its a very private matter I wouldnt like to disclose any information about it and am not looking for any 'Carers Benefits' etc"

I would like to point out that I am not trying to lie to get any sort of benefit I do not desserve or anything like that - I am simply out of work but want to save face and since the company that let me go is by all purposes believe that I left due to "personal reasons" I am not really lying but more so just trying to save face.

Any advice on this matter would be MUCH appreciated as I need to send this form back as a matter of urgency.

Thanks in advance

computershack

You would be sanctioned but you're going to be anyway. Choice is up to you but quite who you think will find out other than the person reading the form is beyond me.

property.advert

I understand where you are coming from but in one instance, the train has already left the station, in that you should have discussed and agreed not only what would be said to people seeking work references but also the benefits agencies. However, it may be that your previous employer would not agree to that. Your resigning, unless due to constructive dismissal, would absolve them of any redundancy or other payments which they may otherwise be forced to make.

There is no reason to hide anything from the benefits people but you must remember that they are a "tick box" organisation and if your claim does not fall within their simple guidelines, then they are stumped and life becomes much more difficult, as you are now finding out. Your resigning means that you have made yourself deliberately unemployed and as such, you are probably not eligible to claim benefits for some standard period of time.

You do not say what your "computer usage" was but if you were viewing !!!!!! for example, then I could also see that even if everyone agreed that you were sacked, it was your actions which let to this and again, there may be a technical issue of you making yourself deliberately unemployed.

To be paid out under your claim, you are going to have to get it agreed with the benefits agency that your employer ended your employment rather than you resigning. In such cases, the benefits agency would need to be sure that your former employer had not failed in paying you any statutory payments owed upon terminating your employment. Here we head back into the muddy waters of being sacked for gross misconduct.

I am not sure what you or they mean by "if I had actively seeked employment before leaving". I know that many employers view people looking for alternative employment as a risk, some are put on gardening leave for instance, because they could be a risk to the company. We do not know what you do.

The easiest thing is to get the benefits agency to accept that your employment was terminated. If you did not have sufficient service to warrant statutory payments upon such termination, then the benefits agency cannot use that as a reason for further investigation. If you did, then you have problems and should have fixed it all up before leaving.

Decades ago I left a job and had them say I was not eligible and the waiting period was 6 or 13 weeks. I suspect it is far longer now. Quite a problem if you are claiming housing benefit, not so bad if you are only claiming the £64.30 a week JSA.

If I were you, I would say that I was let go, not sure I would use the word sacked. Manager thought we couldn't work together or they were not happy with some form of your work, some excuse which is "watery" but conveys the message that you were not to blame, but does not go so far as to state that. You cover the resignation issue by claiming that you thought it would sound better when a prospective new employer requested a reference.

I have been out of the country for a long while but the law as I last knew it was that a previous employer was barred from giving you a poor reference but they could decline to give you a reference. Of course, references taken over the telaphone "never happen" !

In conclusion, you have to get your head around the fact that it does not matter what the benefits people think or what they know. You prospective employer will not ask them for a reference.

If you think there is any means in talking to your previous employer and stating that the benefits people, who he is unlikely to know much about, are going to screw you around unless he states that he let you go, then I would seriously consider that and backtrack down the path that it is merely a misunderstanding.

Oldernotwiser

Without meaning to sound harsh, if you're considering telling JCP that you left your job to look after a family member then you are, in fact, lying to get a benefit for which you aren't eligible, whatever you may think.

Whether you left voluntarily or were sacked for misconduct you may face a sanction on your benefits so you might as well be honest on the form or else there could be further repercussions.

Bobl

You were not sacked, you resigned voluntarily - no matter what the circumstances were. You will be sanctioned. Just put on the form that you were not suited to the work, accept the sanction and keep looking for another job.

Good Luck

bitsandpieces

property.advert wrote: »

I have been out of the country for a long while but the law as I last knew it was that a previous employer was barred from giving you a poor reference but they could decline to give you a reference.

Perfectly legal to give a poor reference, so long as it's accurate and a balanced reflection of someone's work (and, in almost all cases, giving an unfair reference would be a civil rather than criminal matter). If someone leaves because they were using computers inappropriately, it's quite legal to say so. Obviously, if your employer have agreed not to then that's a positive thing for you

Bobl

"To be paid out under your claim, you are going to have to get it agreed with the benefits agency that your employer ended your employment rather than you resigning. In such cases, the benefits agency would need to be sure that your former employer had not failed in paying you any statutory payments owed upon terminating your employment. Here we head back into the muddy waters of being sacked for gross misconduct.

The easiest thing is to get the benefits agency to accept that your employment was terminated. If you did not have sufficient service to warrant statutory payments upon such termination, then the benefits agency cannot use that as a reason for further investigation. If you did, then you have problems and should have fixed it all up before leaving."

Stick to the facts, the OP resigned voluntarily, the employer did not terminate the OP - you can't twist the facts now.

healy

property.advert wrote: »

I understand where you are coming from but in one instance, the train has already left the station, in that you should have discussed and agreed not only what would be said to people seeking work references but also the benefits agencies. However, it may be that your previous employer would not agree to that. Your resigning, unless due to constructive dismissal, would absolve them of any redundancy or other payments which they may otherwise be forced to make.

There is no reason to hide anything from the benefits people but you must remember that they are a "tick box" organisation and if your claim does not fall within their simple guidelines, then they are stumped and life becomes much more difficult, as you are now finding out. Your resigning means that you have made yourself deliberately unemployed and as such, you are probably not eligible to claim benefits for some standard period of time.

You do not say what your "computer usage" was but if you were viewing !!!!!! for example, then I could also see that even if everyone agreed that you were sacked, it was your actions which let to this and again, there may be a technical issue of you making yourself deliberately unemployed.

To be paid out under your claim, you are going to have to get it agreed with the benefits agency that your employer ended your employment rather than you resigning. In such cases, the benefits agency would need to be sure that your former employer had not failed in paying you any statutory payments owed upon terminating your employment. Here we head back into the muddy waters of being sacked for gross misconduct.

I am not sure what you or they mean by "if I had actively seeked employment before leaving". I know that many employers view people looking for alternative employment as a risk, some are put on gardening leave for instance, because they could be a risk to the company. We do not know what you do.

The easiest thing is to get the benefits agency to accept that your employment was terminated. If you did not have sufficient service to warrant statutory payments upon such termination, then the benefits agency cannot use that as a reason for further investigation. If you did, then you have problems and should have fixed it all up before leaving.

Decades ago I left a job and had them say I was not eligible and the waiting period was 6 or 13 weeks. I suspect it is far longer now. Quite a problem if you are claiming housing benefit, not so bad if you are only claiming the £64.30 a week JSA

If I were you, I would say that I was let go, not sure I would use the word sacked. Manager thought we couldn't work together or they were not happy with some form of your work, some excuse which is "watery" but conveys the message that you were not to blame, but does not go so far as to state that. You cover the resignation issue by claiming that you thought it would sound better when a prospective new employer requested a reference.

I have been out of the country for a long while but the law as I last knew it was that a previous employer was barred from giving you a poor reference but they could decline to give you a reference. Of course, references taken over the telaphone "never happen" !

In conclusion, you have to get your head around the fact that it does not matter what the benefits people think or what they know. You prospective employer will not ask them for a reference.

If you think there is any means in talking to your previous employer and stating that the benefits people, who he is unlikely to know much about, are going to screw you around unless he states that he let you go, then I would seriously consider that and backtrack down the path that it is merely a misunderstanding.

There would not be a sanction on the OPs Housing Benefit even if there is a sanction on their JSA.

Uncertain

Did you take legal advice before agreeing to leave in this way? I would have thought that this amounts to a "compromise agreement" even though (I assume) you did not get a pay off?

If it does amount to a CA then it is not valid unless you were professionaly advised.

You have found out one of the snags the hard way in that you won't be able to get benefits for some time.

If it is within 3 months of leaving I would quickly take some advice about your options.

You are putting great store on the agreed reference. Can you police what is said if a prospective employer contacts your old firm? It is quite legal to give a bad reference providing it is true, don't let people tell you otherwise. Some firms choose to restrict what their staff can put in references which is where this myth comes from.

I don't know the details but would your employer legally have been within their rights to sack you for this or might you have had an argueable claim for unfair dismissal?

dookar

OP - without more information it's impossible to say. There are a number of possible scenarios.

On is a sanction for LV, another is a sanction for misconduct.

Be honest and give as much information as you can if they investigate the LV, be honest and comment only on your employers comments if misconduct.

From what you've said I would be surprised if they pursued the case on LV.