M.E, depression + glandular fever link?

Ted_Hutchinson

JayS wrote:

.........<snip..........
St John's Wort can induce drug metabolising enzymes and a number of important interactions with conventional drugs. The amount of active ingredient can vary between different preparations of St John's Wort and switiching from one to another can change the degree of enzyme induction. Furthermore, when a patient stops taking St John's Wort, concentrations of interacting drugs may increase, leading to toxicity. Antidepressants should not be used with St John's wort because of the potential for interaction.
Source: BNF44 Sept 2002

It goes on to list interactions with different prescribed drugs in these catagories: antibacterials, anticoagulants, antidepressants, antiepileptics, antivirals, barbiturates and primidone, caridac glycosides, ciclosporin, 5HT(1) agonist, oestrogens and progestogens, and theophylline.........<snip>.............

JayS

The extensive use of hypericum in Germany (sixty-six million daily doses in 1994) has not resulted in medical reports of serious drug interactions or even toxicity after accidental overdose.

Fatal toxicity of antidepressants in England and Wales, 1993-2002

Edit New evidence from NETDOCTOR added
Herbal remedy 'better than drugs at treating depression'

JayS_3

Ted_Hutchinson wrote:

The extensive use of hypericum in Germany (sixty-six million daily doses in 1994) has not resulted in medical reports of serious drug interactions or even toxicity after accidental overdose.

Fatal toxicity of antidepressants in England and Wales, 1993-2002

Hi Ted,

Thanks for your reply. I'm not referring to accidental overdose, I'm referring to the need for your GP/doctor/consultant/surgeon to know their patient is taking St John's wort if they are prescribing other drugs, as there maybe an adverse interaction between St John's wort and the drugs.

I'm not even supporting an argument for, or against, taking St John's wort; I am only saying anyone treating someone taking it, must be aware of the whole picture (holistic).

I hope you are not taking offence by this comment, none is intended.

Best wishes
JayS

Former_MSE_Controller2

Hi there,

please can I direct your attention to MSE policy on health advice. I think some of the posts here are very close the giving advice. While its obvious that some people here are very knowledgable, your doctor should always be the first port of call for medical advice.

JayS_3

MSE_Controller2 wrote:

Hi there,

please can I direct your attention to MSE policy on health advice. I think some of the posts here are very close the giving advice. While its obvious that some people here are very knowledgable, your doctor should always be the first port of call for medical advice.

I agree, that is exactly the point I am making.

JayS

Cat72

Hi
Hope you are all ok.I have had joint ( knee pain) for a while and from what I have understood this is a symptomn of my ME. In fact even one of the essential ones !! ( the top 8 list of how m.e should be determined). My doctors are not to ggod with their knowledge of m.e and now have said that the joint pain is due to Chondromalacia patellae. If this is the case then is this what M.e patients usually get or is their joint pain something else. Im probably not making myself too clear, but what is joint pain in M.e usually attributed to ? do they say what they think it is ( i presumed it was the virus causing viral arthriits ) .Maybe someone who has M.e and has joint pain can help me out as to what caused their joint pain and what the specialists said about it.The big problem i have with the docs explination is that im in my mid thirtys ( not the general age group) and also have had NO knee injurys at all in the last twenty years.The doc said that it should clear up in about 6 weeks if i do exercises and rest. Uhmn, done nothing but rest for a year !( a year that i have had this pain) !

Honey9036

Hi

Sorry to hear you have been in pain with your knee. I have ME so I can totally sympathise!

My personal experience, however, has been more related to *muscle* pain and tenderness - as opposed to *joints* (in fact *Myalgia*, from Myalgic Encephalomyelitis, translates as *muscle pain*). And my pain is generally all-over and varies in intensity from day to day.

What you have described sounds much more specific. Believe me, you DON'T WANT to have ME!

Obviously you feel unhappy with the situation, which is understandable - no-one wants to be in constant pain with no real explanation. Maybe you should visit your doctor again and ask to be sent for further investigation (eg xrays). Or perhaps you could be referred for some physiotherapy to help strengthen the muscles around the knee joint to give it additional support.

From what I have read about Chondromalacia Patellae it can be due to natural wear and tear and can start from age 40 onwards. The words Chondromalacia Patellae means *softening of the cartilage of the knee-cap*.

I found a good link here: http://www.orthoseek.com/articles/chondromp.html it mentions a few ways of alleviating the pain.

I hope you manage to find a solution to your pain. Definitely speak to your doctor again before trying any course of treatment. Anything I have mentioned is purely my opinion.

Best wishes

Lori

Ted_Hutchinson

MSE_Controller2 wrote:

Hi there,

please can I direct your attention to MSE policy on health advice. I think some of the posts here are very close the giving advice. While its obvious that some people here are very knowledgable, your doctor should always be the first port of call for medical advice.

May I suggest the wise will also double check the medical advice from the GP/Health-professional against information from an impartial source such as
What Doctors Don’t Tell

Cat72

Hi Honey thanks for replying. I have been diagonasised with chronic fatigue syndrome but his time had to attend a different doctor , as my other docs not available for 6 weeks! My usually doctor is very nice and I am due to see a consultant finally in 4 weeks.I have experience the constant tiredness , putting it midily,and have been unable previously to get out of bed. Thankfully I have improved a LOT recently and most of my symptons have toned down a lot - even starting to remember things a bit !. Sometimes my legs would feel " itchy" at night but it has been the joint pain that has been constant and never improved. I was just wondering if anyone else with joint pain and fatigue syndrome/ M.E had any explination for what their joint pain is. With the docs explination of chondromalacia patellae he related it more to teenagers symptons ie." you are a bit unfit, or maybe damanged yourelf running" ( yeek i think i ran for a bus in 1994) it will go away in about 6 weeks ! In the meantime here is some ibrufen.

Ted_Hutchinson

A news item on radio today prompted me to include the following ling to The National Institute for Clinical Excellence where you can find the guidance for Depression
in particular the following
CG23 Depression - Information for the public
From which I quote
Exercise
Exercise can improve your health and lift your mood. Your GP may advise you to follow an exercise programme. A programme usually consists of up to 3 sessions per week (lasting 45 minutes to 1 hour) for between 10 and 12 weeks.

I wasn't aware, till I heard the news item that this can be prescribed by your doctor. So it may be relevant to other readers as well.

Baglady_2

Hi all. I have a tale of woe similar to most of you, been ill for 11 years now, have tried various complementary therapies because mainstream medicine offers so little. Had battles with DSS which CAB helped with.

Last summer started having Kinesiology, and learnt that not only did I have Epstein Barr virus, but also Cocksackie virus, both implicated with being forerunners of M.E./CFS. In addition, I had a bacterial infection of long-standing, the one causing Lyme disease (similar symptoms to M.E./CFS).

I feel I have turned the corner and feel very hopefulfor the future. It wont be overnight because none of us got ill overnight. Its no fun watching your life go down the pan and feel so helpless. Anyway, I can recommend trying this treatment, its fascinating as new things surface to be dealt with, like peeling off the layers and feeling that much better than before.


Thanks for the tip about zipvit, I agree that its really hard for us who can hardly string 2 thoughts together to try and make sense of whats happening and put it right, and have to convince the doctors and DSS that yes we are ill and no, we dont have the energy to explain. Thats why I love this site. All the money I can save means I can afford to eat better, buy supplements and get regular treatment now I've found something that is helping, and hopefully get my life back. I wish the same for all of you too and think we should give ourselves a round of applause for keeping going when this is such a rotten, soul destroying and often hidden illness. Cheers! :T