Gas Fires - do I always need the vent?

aylesby

The last gas fire installation included a compulsory outside vent for our protection against fumes. Trouble is it’s cold and draughty. Does any one know what the rules are and are there gas fires that can be fitted in a chimney that do not need such a vent.

stilernin

aylesby wrote: »

The last gas fire installation included a compulsory outside vent for our protection against fumes. Trouble is it’s cold and draughty. Does any one know what the rules are and are there gas fires that can be fitted in a chimney that do not need such a vent.

I've just had a survey for cavity wall insulation and have been told that I will have to have vents put in the outside wall because of the living flame gas fire. I already have the grills in the floor, but the new insulation may block up the flow to the outside.

The surveyor did add that 'some people block up the vent in the wall after the work was done' :eek:

He also talked about new condensing gas fires that didn't need ventilation. I haven't investigated these yet.

poppyolivia

I had an old gas fire, got it changed changed to a living flame one and they had to drill a hole in my wall which is low and behind the sofa (sofa at angle so not covering it)...its about the size of a saucer and has a grid over it inside and outside...they said it 100% needed done for safety and never to be covered up....real drafty!!!!!!!!!!!!

sillygoose

I have a memory of my parents having one put in with the same problem. They were able to have some type with a built in fan that sucks the fumes out. It had a safety circuit built in that detected should the fan not work and cut the gas and refused to light until sorted out.

ormus

our lounge room vent used to have a slide so that you could open/close it.
when we had a new fire fitted the plumber made us change it to a proper fixed open one.
i changed it back afterwards. but i make sure its open when the fires in use.
(fire is rarely used, more of a decoration item).

moonrakerz

On a "normal" gas fire you need two vents.
One to get rid of the combustion products, which are very dangerous. Unless you have a special type of "flueless" fire.
You need another to supply fresh air to the fire to get correct combustion. If you don't have this your fire will create large quantities of dangerous fumes.

This, I believe, depends on the size of the fire in question.

I had my central heating serviced yesterday, the fitter checked that I had sufficient air supply into the kitchen as well as the flue from the unit.

Suggest you talk to a registered gas fitter.

http://www.gassaferegister.co.uk/

Errata

aylesby wrote: »

The last gas fire installation included a compulsory outside vent for our protection against fumes. Trouble is it’s cold and draughty. Does any one know what the rules are and are there gas fires that can be fitted in a chimney that do not need such a vent.

So was mine until I stuffed a couple of jumpers in it. Which are removed before the annual inspection and replaced afterwards.

PasturesNew

My very elderly parents had a (draughty) vent fitted just above the skirting board after one annual inspection. A year later the next engineer said the first one wasn't up to scratch, even though the previous engineer had approved it.

Sometimes you just feel they're all taking the p155.

AdrianW2

Strange forum this; gets all paranoid about electrical safety and yet is cavalier about gas poisoning where the fatality rate is an order of magnitude greater.

andrew-b

AdrianW2 wrote: »

Strange forum this; gets all paranoid about electrical safety and yet is cavalier about gas poisoning where the fatality rate is an order of magnitude greater.

True enough but can you link me to a page on the internet (that's not going to cost me money) giving me a guide of how to determine the requirements for ventilation for a gas fire in order to meet the regs?

I appreciate the regs are there for a reason and the dangers of incomplete combustion of gas with the associated affects of carbon monoxide ..however as a member of the general public as yet i've drawn a blank on where i can establish exactly whether i need ventilation for my gas fire or not. If i were telling people well actually you don't need a vent and that's wrong then that's clearly dangerous!

Like electricians, those on the gas safe register can't really give a definitive answer..their public liability insurance and gas safe register advise them not to?

I've already asked this on another thread but not got a definitive answer or been able to find relevant information anywhere as of yet (perhaps i'm looking in the wrong place?). As i understand it so far the requirement for ventilation depends upon the input power rating of the gas fire and the size of the room. Obviously there is a calculation for this somwhere but i've yet to find it.

This is the problem the regulations on ventilation of gas appliances need to be more readily available.

We also have cavity wall insulation installers (was a post the other day) claiming the need for ventilation in any room with a fire - the OP in that particular thread had no form of fire (gas or otherwise) in their fireplace yet the installer still refused to install insulation. However as far as i am aware no qualifications are required to be a "surveyor" for a cavity wall insulation company or to actually install it - it's not their remit and shouldn't be! This is the remit of those on the gas safe register.

The way to solve all these safety concerns over gas is IMHO to introduce a compulsory gas safety check for every household supplied by gas (or those buying oil/LPG/propane for heating) similar to that legally required for a rental property with carbon monoxide alarms a compulsory part of getting a PASS and to provide publicly accessible information that is simple to understand and accessible free of charge outlining exactly what the requirements on ventilation are. Funding such a policy is the problem..perhaps we should all be paying a yearly/monthly charge to our gas suppliers which is the obvious way to fund it - perhaps with more vulnerable groups such as the elderly, those with children and those on qualifying benefits to get it free/subsidised. Safety nearly always involves money unfortunately!

Swipe

Buy a £15 CO alarm/detector and then you will know if it's safe to keep any vents blocked.