Summoned to court for scratching a car!

Help_Please_7

Hi,

Umm, well firstly here's what they've told me:

On bla bla date at bla bla place in the county of bla bla being the driver of a mechanically propelled vehicle namely bla blah (cheap old banger) owing to the presence of which on a public place namely bla blah car park, bla blah street bla blah town an accident occured whereby damage was caused to another vehicle, namely Mitsubishi Pajero (2000 model) (£3000 on eBay (used the completed item search) failed to stop contrary to section 170(4) of the road traffic act 1988 and schedule 2 to the road traffic offenders act 1988

I've looked up what it says, and basically I could get 5-10 points (I've been driving less than a year so could lose my license if I get 6+ points), plus a fine on Standard Scale 5 which appears to be a maximum of £5000.
However elsewhere I read about the units system which takes disposable income into consideration, full details here. I haven't kept links to everywhere, but some site gave the impression that the maximum fine would be £1650 and the minimum fine would be £200... not sure about this though.

Maybe you could work this bit out for me, I have a weekly income wildly differing between nil and a hundred or so, because I'm currently Self-Employed and don't get any work for weeks on end.
I also get £150 a week in benefits because I'm disabled.
My essential outgoings generally exceed my income (I'm in a considerable amount of debt!) and I probably spend too much on non-essentials too (I have credit cards etc!).

On Schedule 2 (mentioned above) there's various columns and I'm not sure what each one means. I think the last one is talking about the number of units I would have to pay as a fine, and I don't know what the obligatory and discretionary ones mean (I think that's what they said... well anyway if I lose my license I won't be able to get any acting work at all (because I can't get to the places I need to get arriving for 5am usually!).

Anyway I hope some of you will be able to offer me advice etc about this, lastly I'll give you my defence:

I'm deaf in one ear, and didn't hear the accident. My friend who was in the car also didn't notice that we'd scratched the car (which by the way seemingly happened whilst I was trying to park - I remember pulling into a space and then leaving because there was no room to open the doors (the 4x4 was way over the white line and the car barely got into the space at all (I had only passed my test about 3 weeks before...!).
Also, we did stop (still didn't notice it) but even if we had there was no relevant person to report the accident to (and the act asks that we should stop and report it to any relevant person). The shame is, it then goes on to say we should tell the police within 5 days (or a constable), but I didn't know I'd done it so how could I have reported it!

Thanks for reading, I'm really hoping someone'll be able to reassure/advise me on this - I can't lose my license (and don't have any savings/income to pay a fine with, I'll end up on the street if I get ordered to pay a huge fine (or in prison!!)).

Searcher

I've read and re-read this 3 or 4 times and the thing I can't get my head round is on who's say so are you being charged?
I'm assuming that the owner of the Mitsubishi has reported you to the police and also you don't mention that the police have spoken to you so I'm further assuming that there must have been witnesses?
Is there any corresponding damage to your car?
I find it hard to believe that neither you nor your passenger noticed that you'd done any damage and although you mention that you're deaf in one ear I'm guessing that your friend isn't?
If you really don't think you've damaged the car then use that as your defence but if you do end up getting fined then you can make an arrangement to pay the court at £x per month.
£5 used to be a favourite figure but you'd need to prove to the court that's all you can afford.
If you do make an arrangemnt though make sure you stick to it and don't miss any payments.
It's been a long long time since I was fined for any motoring offences but as far as I'm aware the courts don't want to see anyone destitute and they certainly would rather you pay than put you in jail.
So long as you keep to the agreement of course lol

Bossyboots

This could be the prosecution chancing their arm and issuing a summons to see whether you plead guilty. It may well be that if you ask for a court date to plead not guilty they will drop the summons. That would be my first choice, because you need to know what evidence they have against you. You and your friend say you do not remember an accident. What proof is there that the scratch was caused by your car? I would say none unless someone was watching who did not speak to you or someone is prepared to lie. They have to prove you did it, you do not have to prove you didn't.

As for the fines and points, if you accepted you scratched the car you could still ask to be heard on mitigation. From my experience, you are more at risk of points than a big fine but if you are sure you did not cause the scratch, then you shouldn't put your hands up to it.

sunflower_2

really sorry but being a victim of someone scratching my new car and just driving off on more than one occasion - i think you deserve to be taken to court

over the years damage to my car (through other people) has cost me £1000+

far too many people get away with this
as per previous post - didnt your friend hear it?

i also think you would have felt some sort of impact.

your post states that there was no-one to report the accident to - but why would you be looking to see if there was anyone around if you didnt know of any damage?

the fact that you did get parked but then drove away, and try to blame the parking of the damaged car - sort of admits your guilt in my eyes

sorry if i am wrong - but i am on the side of the victim

Becles

Help_Please wrote:

Also, we did stop (still didn't notice it) but even if we had there was no relevant person to report the accident to (and the act asks that we should stop and report it to any relevant person).

I clipped someones bumper in a car park causing a minor scrape. There was nobody about, so I left my name and phone number on a note under their windscreen wipers.

The man phoned and I apologised. He was nice about it, and got his mate to spray the scrape for £20, so I sent him a cheque to cover it.

hollydays

As allready queried-who was the letter from?

IvanOpinion

Help_Please wrote:

I'm deaf in one ear, and didn't hear the accident. My friend who was in the car also didn't notice that we'd scratched the car (which by the way seemingly happened whilst I was trying to park - I remember pulling into a space and then leaving because there was no room to open the doors (the 4x4 was way over the white line and the car barely got into the space at all (I had only passed my test about 3 weeks before...!).
Also, we did stop (still didn't notice it) but even if we had there was no relevant person to report the accident to (and the act asks that we should stop and report it to any relevant person). The shame is, it then goes on to say we should tell the police within 5 days (or a constable), but I didn't know I'd done it so how could I have reported it!

I am another victim of a hit and run in a car park on my car (just paid out to get damage fixed). I can understand why the owner of the vehicle is annoyed ... they will just see it as a hit and run.

You seem to pretty much accept you hit the car since you say you 'did stop'. It is also obvious that there was at least one witness to the incident since they seem to have your registration details.

I don't have time to look it up but what does the highway code say about reporting accidents etc. (you have just sat your test you should know this .. old foggies like me who passed years ago can't even remember what it says on the front cover not to worry inside).

The fine is not likely to be heavy however the owner of the other vehicle is likely to want you to fix their car. I wouldn't however suggest using 'deafness' as a mitigating excuse (someone may question if you are fit to hold a licence) ... simply tell the truth, you thought you had clipped the car, you stopped, you and your passenger got out and looked but could see no damage therefore you drove on.

Ivan

Help_Please_7

What I meant when I said we stopped was that we parked about 10 metres away in a different space and walked off, so I suppose that's not really stopping.
The letter was from a Magistrates Court.

your post states that there was no-one to report the accident to - but why would you be looking to see if there was anyone around if you didnt know of any damage?

Good point. Actually I didn't mean it to come out quite like that, what I meant was that we parked very nearby and no "relevant person" came over to ask for our insurance details, so from that I assumed that if there'd be any "relevant people" about they would've!

i also think you would have felt some sort of impact.

I agree, I think we would've noticed, but someone reported my number plate to the supermarket who's car park we were in, and they found a mark on my car (not even through the paint, despite it being an old banger!) that they reckon showed we'd hit a car recently (hadn't noticed the mark myself, but then again the car's one of these noisy rattily (as in rattle, not sure how to spell that...) ones and has bumps and scratches all over (cost £150!).


And thanks Searcher, but they've told me to bring a method of payment so I think it's at the magistrates discretion whether they make me pay on the day or not (or go to prison for upto a month!!)... stupid thing is a Detective Inspector came round and told me what I'd done and I said in a statement that I had (since it could've happened and he didn't make it sound very serious (and I'm not used to dealing with the police, should've asked for a lawyer or something probably, but it was at my house so it was a bit weird doing that)). Problem is now it looks like I knew at the time, which makes me look guilty!).

Astaroth

The fact you have said to the DI that you did it makes you look more guilty.

At the end of the day you can plead ignorance (to the incident) and poverty and try to get a fine/ penalty points below the average but it is simply a case of stating the case as you remember it being and taking your chances with the magistrates. The problem with blaming disabilities or ignorance of not knowing to report it to the police does mean people can question your fitness to drive - esp as you have so recently passed your test.

hollydays

One would have thought a PC would have been sent-and as i guess the car park may have been private i thought this would have been a civil matter.

paultw5

http://www.pepipoo.com/

this website will tell you about the rights and wrongs of the road laws etc.