Architects/ structural Engineers or Builders suggestions for RSJ

monstermonster_2

Hi there, i'm hoping to buy a house but me and gf are set on making the kitchen bigger. Its currently L shaped within an single storey extension and thought we could remove the dividing walls up but it isn't that easy. 2 of the wall are load bearing. If you look at this rough plan you'll see: file dropper dot com /houseplan [enter www. then Please remove spaces from blue text!!] ( plan is not to scale!)
Someone suggested running an RSJ out from the stairs cupboard (into the blockwork) then out to the brick wall of the extension thus taking the weight of the external gable wall above, however if you see from the photo: file dropper dot com /houserearphoto (Remove spaces again!!), the wall of the extension has a window where this would run through and there is not enough structiural strength to put a RSJ abouv the window frame.
Is it possible to get Y shaped RSJs thus taking the load along the straight line then directing it off to the 2 corners of the extension? (hope you follow what i mean)

Any suggestions really appreciated. Me and the gf really want this house (offer accepted and well down the line) but we really had hoped we could open up the kitchen properly....gf says she doesn't want it if we cant do it .

thanks:D

dander

Should first of all say that I'm not an expert so don't have any specialist knowledge to offer, but my first thought is why not just block the window up where the steel would have to go and either make it a smaller window or knock a new window out elsewhere?

My second thought is that if it's that important to your gf, get someone in to give you an idea of how much all this would cost - I imagine getting the steels in to support a whole corner of a house like that could be pretty pricy. You might find it makes more sense to cut and run before costs spiral.

keystone

You would be crazy to make the buy / do not buy decision on the basis of structural advice received on here with the only input being a floor plan and a photograph. I can see it ending in tears one way or the other.

If its important (and I think it is) you need to get a structural engineer in there very quickly to see for himself, discuss what you want to do and advise you properly. That you will have to pay for I guess.

Cheers

edgex

your 2nd linky dosnt work by the way


as others have said, you really need to get a professional in
have you asked your surveyor for ideas?

the issue i can see with it is that the extension has been 'wrapped' round the corner of the building, & so to be able to open it up any more would mean taking out that corner.
i doubt that single-storey extension walls & foundations were designed to be able to take the weight of 2 storeys & a roof.

Doozergirl

My instinct would be not to make it all open plan but create an open plan space with a utility.

I love open plan living but the fact is that you will end up living with less walls for storage with the washing machine and tumble making noise so it's best to have a utility for the ugly and noisy stuff.

Therefore I would remove the existing wall where the fridge and boiler sit, run the RSJ from the stairs, taking out as much of that wall as possible whilst leaving the necessary room to support the RSJ - not taking it to the window but the original corner of the house by the archway. The archway becomes a utility door and you build a new wall across from there to where the hob is now. So that section that juts out becomes the utility and you are left with a rectangular, open plan kitchen diner. You will have some wall jutting out but the kitchen units can run from that all the way across - it won't block anyone's view down the room.

It is practical and cheaper than trying to remove the corner of a house. Are there two front doors there? You'd be opening one into the kitchen or remove it altogether and start using the front door again. That back hall is a waste of space.

Clear as mud?

EliteHeat

I think Doozergirl is Sarah Beeney and I claim my £5.

Architectural_Ant

You need to get a Structural Engineer to look at it, as removing the corner of your house, won't be the most sraightforward thing ever. Doozergirls solution (if i understand this correctly) relies heavily on being able to bear a steel down onto the brickwork adjacent to the arch, the fact the arch is there probably means it has some form of lintel supporting the brickwork above it as its quite rare these days for an arch to be constructed in the traditional manner, this in turn means that where the new steel would need to be placed may well already have a lintel in the way.

Speak to an Engineer.

Where are you in the country, i may be able to point you in the right direction.

PM me if you like.

EliteHeat

Darn, there goes my five quid.

Doozergirl

Architectural_Ant wrote: »

You need to get a Structural Engineer to look at it, as removing the corner of your house, won't be the most sraightforward thing ever. Doozergirls solution (if i understand this correctly) relies heavily on being able to bear a steel down onto the brickwork adjacent to the arch

No, I wasn't suggesting it sat right next to the archway nor that the corner is actually removed. I would leave that archway wall entirely alone. There is a certain amount of wall that you need to leave before a junction of two structural walls to meet building regulations when you put in one RSJ. Just resting it on the archway wall wouldn't be enough.

I was actually suggesting that you could leave up to 600mm of the wall being removed in place, looking like a flying buttress. The kitchen would be a gally kitchen - if you were to put kitchen units against it, heading over towards where the hob used to be, the small amount of wall left wouldn't actually impede upon the view down the room. You'd have the utility door to the left of it and kitchen units butted up against the right running the rest of the length of the room. To all intents and purposes it would be a rectangular, open plan room - if you created a utility.

EliteHeat, your fiver is safe

Architectural_Ant

Doozergirl wrote: »

No, I wasn't suggesting it sat right next to the archway nor that the corner is actually removed. I would leave that archway wall entirely alone. There is a certain amount of wall that you need to leave before a junction of two structural walls to meet building regulations when you put in one RSJ. Just resting it on the archway wall wouldn't be enough.

Ok I see.
What you say is right however Building Regulations is guidance only if an Engineer can design and calculate a beam to suit, it would be ok. Trying to give detailed advice based on a sketch isn't adviseable. As I said before your best off getting an engineer to look at it.

Doozergirl

Architectural_Ant wrote: »

Ok I see.
What you say is right however Building Regulations is guidance only if an Engineer can design and calculate a beam to suit, it would be ok. Trying to give detailed advice based on a sketch isn't adviseable. As I said before your best off getting an engineer to look at it.

And there was me giving the OP the benefit of the doubt for having some common sense. If being told three times to talk to a professional hadn't yet kicked in.