MSE News: Reaction to Halifax's changes

MSE_Martin

rb10 wrote: »

A few points from the article...



No, this is incorrect. The Ultimate Reward account currently has an interest-free overdraft of up to £300. This will continue as a fee-free overdraft of up to £300. (Take a look at page 2 here for confirmation of this).



What about those of us who don't use an overdraft at all?



... or stay in credit for most/all of the month.



There is huge pressure on all banks, whether Government backed or not, to reduce these charges. Much of this pressure comes from this site.

All your points are technically correct, but do seem rather out of context to me?

This is a guide specifically called "how to beat halifax's new overdraft charges" - it is not a generalised review it is targetted only about those overdraft charges and for those peopel who are overdrawn.

I haven't gone into great detail about the rewards account which as we both know is a good deal for those in credit and offsets some of the overdraft cost. Yet I have certainly suggested that for those who earn enough they consdier it. Plus where I talk about ditching and switching it indeeds links to the best bank account article where Halifax's in credit scheme is listed.

Yet of course many of those who are in credit are not with the rewards account, they are with the so-called higher interest account where the in-credit interest will drop to diddly squat. Though again as we've covered that in a past news article I didnt want to retread the ground.

That's why I find your comments quite strange. I have tried carefully to balance the piece and resisted calls to say "its awful" as it isn't awful for everyone it all depends on circumstance.

Yet I have always in my pieces and guides distringuished between those who are 'always' in credit and those who are 'occassionally, sometimes or always' overdrawn and this guide is very specific, and obviously for the latter?

As for the ultimate reward account, I'll take a look, I was referring to the main halifax accounts, and as Im allergic to fee paying accounts like this tend not to consider them, but its an important note and I'll make a small change ta for pointing it out.

Martin

psychic_teabag

MSE_Martin wrote: »

I haven't gone into great detail about the rewards account which as we both know is a good deal for those in credit and offsets some of the overdraft cost. Yet I have certainly suggested that for those who earn enough they consdier it.

The articles on the main site always seem to talk about 'if your salary is X, you can use this account' but I think that's misleading. eg here, for the reward account

With this product, as long as you pay in £1,000 a month, another way of saying you ensure a salary of £15,000 or over goes in, it'll give you £5 a month after basic savings tax.

Paying in £1000 a month is not another way of saying you need a salary of £15,000. That salary is merely one way of achieving £1000 per month.But if you have savings of £1000 in an instant-access account, you can just move it in and out temporarily to get the bonus, for example. You can use standing orders to automate the process.

schweppes31

Yes, I got one of these letters in the post and I'm shocked. Having talked to the bank it seems that they won't back down on this for me, so I will be leaving. I will be closing ALL my accounts there, and transferring the five figure sum from the savings account I have with them to a new account and moving a five figure sum from my online share dealing account to one somewhere else (that has lower dealing charges by the way).

I've put up with higher charges on things like sharedealing for some time when compared to Hoodless Brennan although the Halifax seems to like me - they offered me £200 for a new dealing thing earlier this week for example.

I find it obscene that the charges in no way relate to the amount of money one would be overdrawn by. Come to think of it, wasn't this one reason for the whole bank charges thing, that the charges in no way related to the amount one was overdrawn by and as a result they represented a penalty?

Anyway, thank you Halifax for breaking the camel's back with this straw. I'll be leaving before your wonderful new charges. Just think of all the £25 dealing costs you're not going to be getting from me now on stock market transactions.

YorkshireBoy

schweppes31 wrote: »

Yes, I got one of these letters in the post and I'm shocked. Having talked to the bank it seems that they won't back down on this for me, so I will be leaving. I will be closing ALL my accounts there, and transferring the five figure sum from the savings account I have with them to a new account and moving a five figure sum from my online share dealing account to one somewhere else (that has lower dealing charges by the way).

Sounds like they've done you a massive favour here. You're one of the lucky ones.

1. They've made you find a better savings rate elsewhere.
2. They've made you realise you can get cheaper dealing costs elsewhere.

Everyone's a winner then. Always good to get a result.

Just as an aside, it's good that you're moving on principle, and in support of others less fortunate than yourself, because anyone with 5 figure savings account balances will never incur overdraft charges...will they? They'd just make sure they had a float in the current account surely?

...the charges in no way related to the amount one was overdrawn by and as a result they represented a penalty?

This is a charge for a service. You want to borrow money...any money...it'll cost you £1/£2 a day. Crystal clear! Exactly what the OFT wanted.

Just think of all the £25 dealing costs you're not going to be getting from me now on stock market transactions.

Which will be offset many 10s/100s of thousands of times by the £1/£2/£5 fees that others will pay. You think they'll miss you?

apt

Surely you are cutting off your nose to spite your face there Schweppes. If you have a five figure sum in an accessible savings account why not stick a few hundred of this into a Halifax Reward Account as a float to make sure you do not go overdrawn? That way Halifax will be paying you £60 tax free per year, and you will be paying them nothing. To get £60 after tax elsewhere you would need to put around £2,000 into an account.

opinions4u

schweppes31 wrote: »

Yes, I got one of these letters in the post and I'm shocked. Having talked to the bank it seems that they won't back down on this for me

Did you really expect them to say "yes, we'll run an account with a specific set of terms and conditions just for you"?

so I will be leaving.

As is your choice.

I will be closing ALL my accounts there, and transferring the five figure sum from the savings account I have with them to a new account and moving a five figure sum from my online share dealing account to one somewhere else (that has lower dealing charges by the way).

So you have over £10k in savings and you are worrying about overdraft charges. Ok. Your choice how you manage your money I suppose.

I have genuine sympathy with people stuck within an overdraft who are going to pay more and struggle more to bring the debt down. I don't really have the slightest idea why you are going to lose out.

I find it obscene that the charges in no way relate to the amount of money one would be overdrawn by. Come to think of it, wasn't this one reason for the whole bank charges thing, that the charges in no way related to the amount one was overdrawn by and as a result they represented a penalty?

Precisely. These charges are clearly positioned as cost of a service and not as a penalty. Why else do you think they have made a change?

Anyway, thank you Halifax for breaking the camel's back with this straw. I'll be leaving before your wonderful new charges. Just think of all the £25 dealing costs you're not going to be getting from me now on stock market transactions.

Blimey, I only pay £11.95!

Are you a troll?

noh

schweppes31 wrote: »

Yes, I got one of these letters in the post and I'm shocked. Having talked to the bank it seems that they won't back down on this for me, so I will be leaving. I will be closing ALL my accounts there, and transferring the five figure sum from the savings account I have with them to a new account and moving a five figure sum from my online share dealing account to one somewhere else (that has lower dealing charges by the way).

I've put up with higher charges on things like sharedealing for some time when compared to Hoodless Brennan although the Halifax seems to like me - they offered me £200 for a new dealing thing earlier this week for example.

I find it obscene that the charges in no way relate to the amount of money one would be overdrawn by. Come to think of it, wasn't this one reason for the whole bank charges thing, that the charges in no way related to the amount one was overdrawn by and as a result they represented a penalty?

Anyway, thank you Halifax for breaking the camel's back with this straw. I'll be leaving before your wonderful new charges. Just think of all the £25 dealing costs you're not going to be getting from me now on stock market transactions.

Don't understand your post.
Halifax sharedealing charge £11.95 for online deals.
http://www.halifax.co.uk/sharedealing/charges/share_dealing_charges.asp

Hoodless Brennan as far as I am aware no longer offer execution only accounts.
They redirect you to TD Waterhouse

http://trading.tdwaterhouse.co.uk/hoodlessbrennan_accountopening/

To transfer your holdings from Halifax sharedealing will cost £15 per holding

http://www.halifax.co.uk/sharedealing/charges/administration_charges.asp

so where are you moving to and what do you gain by moving?

bristolleedsfan

Lynie wrote: »

'some people don't realise that an overdraft is not their money- it's the bank's money. Personally I never go into overdraft- I know exactly what's in my account and wouldn't dream of using money that wasn't mine.'

A lot of us would share that sentiment, personally I believe that the new charging structure is fair because I never go overdrawn.

Halifax are allowing a 5 day authorised overdraft free fee period each month ( up to 2500) by virtue of it paying 5.00 a month to those who credit their accounts with 1000.00 each month. It does not have to be 1000.00 credited in 1 go, it can be recycled money, i.e the same money that goes in can come back out and go back in again. Many of us have 3 accounts and use the same money to gain 15.00 a month credit, that 15.00 a month credit can pay for 15 days authorised overdraft free fee period each month ( up to 2500) for those that do need to use the banks money. ( Someone elses money lent on a business basis.)

Please note I am not having a dig merely adding some balance and a different point of view, If you/anyone else want to use an overdraft facility then that is a matter for your/themselves. Im merely agreeing that it is the banks money, the easiest way to avoid charges is not to use banks money, and that halifax do offer fee free authorised overdraft days each month to those who credit their account(s) with 1000.00 during that month.

tradetime

'some people don't realise that an overdraft is not their money- it's the bank's money.

Normally I'd actually have a somewhat sympathetic ear to that point of view but given the amount of Taxpayer money pumped into the Halifax / Lloyds Bank I'd probably have been tempted to tell the condescending young lady she should consider herself lucky to still have a job.
http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article14432.html

To steal a line from investor Jim Rogers "When nobody can fail, everybody fails."

opinions4u

tradetime wrote: »

I'd probably have been tempted to tell the condescending young lady she should consider herself lucky to still have a job.

Ignoring the rather dramatic economic consequences of allowing a bank to collapse as you suggest, HBOS has more personal customers than any other bank.

Had the organisation been wound up and FSCS payments made, those customers would still need banking facilities somewhere. So they'd move elsewhere.

The remaining retail banks would have a big increase in the number of customers and number of transactions to manage, and as a result would need to significantly increase their staff (probably under TUPE arrangements) to cope with the increased demand for service.

So while the staff member may have lost her HBOS job if the normal laws of economics were applied, she would almost certainly have been able to find employment in the remaining banks who wouldn't, otherwise, have been able to cope.