HELP! need advice RE renting from a friend

Danni1986

hi thanks for all your replies!

the deal with the cat is that i would only be responsible for feeding/watering the cat, and getting it to a vet in an emergency. they would provide food/litter/vets payment, which is wat they do now anyway. they currently go in twice a day to feed cat, but are very busy and would prefer someone living there to air place/keep cat company, and old man is in agreement. and yes i am a very animalsort of person, i have horses/dogs/cats at my parents house.

i have told them, i can only afford to pay £30 per week which would cover the cost of council tax and then i would pay utility bills myself. they just dont want to be seen to be taking any money off of me, because, as you said, it is not in the best interest of the old man or his property and the money grabbing relatives could have a case against them. my friend has made it quite clear she doesnt want to make any money out of it, she just wants someone else to take over the cat, and make the place a home again!

G_M

Go to landlordzone where there are some good property lawyers and pose the Q.

It sounds to me like the friends, having EPOA, have authority to make decisions on the owner's behalf, but you/they need to be sure.
It's possible that if no rent is paid either to the friends or the owner, you could stay there without forming an Assured Shorthold Tenancy. Again, you need to be sure.
If you pay his bills, still in his name, as/when they arrive (gas, council tax etc) that might not create an AST.

You might need a document granting you a licence (NOT a tenancy) to stay. That would be more like a house-sitter/visitor who helps with bills.

HOWEVER, you need some expert advice as I might be talking cr*p!

If I'm right, you would have few, if any rights so could be kicked out any time.
If I'm wrong, the friends might end up with an AST and all the legal responsibility of Landlords.

ps - there's almost certainly insurance issues. Most standard home insurance requires only family to occupy. Your presence could invalidate the policy unless permission for a 'guest' were sought/granted.

Fire_Fox

Jowo wrote: »

I can't help thinking it would be better to employ a house sitter or have the family friend visit the property regularly to deter squatters andn employ a separate cat sitter or get the cat fostered by a cat charity.

Most animal charities are not taking on new cats at the moment as they are chocka with recession casualties. The cat would either end up in a pen, or fostered out in someone's spare room: my Noah (age three) lived in a tiny boxroom for eight months. :eek:

By five years old it's tough to find a home, people want kittens and young cats. I agree the cat needs to be put on an adoption list at some point but this cat may well have to stay put, unless of course the old man dies. Some charities are PTS anything older they don't have space for.

OP if it ever becomes urgent to find this cat a home and there is no space in the local rescues, post up on the Purrsinourhearts website and you will get all the help you need, people drive hundreds of miles to foster a cat in dire need.

Oldernotwiser

What have you personally got to lose if this all goes pear shaped? Would you be giving up a secure tenancy to take up this opportunity, for example?

If you can't lose out in any way I'd let your boss worry about his own concerns ad do what suits you.

paddy's_mum

If it all goes wrong, bearing in mind it is your boss suggesting this, would you find your job under threat too?

belisha-beacon

A couple of issues to consider:

1) If you take this on not as a tenant but as a cat-sitter, what happens if the cat dies (or is mysteriously poisoned by distant money-grabbing relatives) You'd be in a tricky position living in a house that allegedly goes with a job that no longer exists

2) By renting this out not at market value, your friends are really putting themselves at risk in my opinion (but I'm not legally qualified in any way) Power of attorney requires you to always act in the best interests of the person concerned - I think that it would be difficult for them to argue that letting one of their personal friends live in it essentially for free (when it might have been possible to get rental income) would be in the best interests of the owner. Yes, safety certificates etc come at a cost but they would be more than met by regular monthly rental income. Admittedly if all of his own furniture is there and it comes with a cat-sitting requirement, they could charge less rent than would normally be expected but I think that they should charge some.

From what you say, it sounds like they have entirely good motives and are not trying to do anything bad for the owner. But imagine the scene if these money-grabbing relatives are missed out of the will or anything like that. A challenge that your friends were obviously not looking out for the man and were letting friends stay in his house for free during his lifetime will not look good. I think that, in a worst-case scenario, if the man becomes unable to state his own wishes then they could challenege to get guardianship themselves on the grounds that the power of attorney was clearly not being used in the correct way.

I think that your friends should take legal advice, or ask for advice from the Office of the Public Guardian (who control powers of attorney and can advise what is and is not appropriate) before going ahead with anything like this.

SandC

I know everyone is being very negative here, but as far as I can see, unless you are giving up a nice rental for this (which I suspect not as you have stated you can't afford to pay rent), then surely this is just you staying in someone's house as a favour? After all the owner is happy with the arrangement too.

Personally I would go for it so long as if the worst comes to the worst you can deal with it - which I suspect would be nothing more than having to leave at short notice.

franklee

SandC wrote: »

I know everyone is being very negative here, but as far as I can see, unless you are giving up a nice rental for this (which I suspect not as you have stated you can't afford to pay rent), then surely this is just you staying in someone's house as a favour? After all the owner is happy with the arrangement too.

Personally I would go for it so long as if the worst comes to the worst you can deal with it - which I suspect would be nothing more than having to leave at short notice.

One is a tenant by what one and the landlord do (pay rent, LL not an occupier, no written agreement etc.) , that is the actual living arrangements. Calling it something else informally with no written agreement doesn't change what it actually is.

If the OP pays no rent at all then it won't be a tenancy.

The negativity from me comes from the OP's "they just don't want to be seen to be taking any money off of me, because, as you said, it is not in the best interest of the old man or his property". Smacks of cheating. If all is above board then they should write it down and be clear, not try to hide it. Wonder what the tax man would say about money changing hands this way Not to mention the insurance, as others have already said, who will need to know and agree the owner is still covered, for insurance you have to declare all material facts.

Pee

You should have a formal legal agreement drawn up, just setting out the basics, that you would be paying all bills and what would happen if the boiler stops working etc. You would want three months to move out when the elderly relative died or wanted to return.

Danni1986

hello thanks for all your opinions and advice. deep down i want to wait until we have an AST drawn up, its just such a good opportunity whether its rent free or a small amount i wont have another chance to live in a nice place in a nice area this cheaply. Im just out of uni, so money is tight. im going to put all of this to them, it seems to me from what everyone has said and looking stuff up online, that it would be in the owners best interest to have the place and cat looked after. numerous sites have stated that a person with power of attorney is within their rights to let or sell someones property as long as it is in the persons best interest. well in this particular case, the man will not be going back to the property, he is of good mental health and has stated that he wants the cat and furniture to stay and hes happy for someone to live there. he has enough separate money available to pay for his nursing home and needs, so an income from rent wouldnt be nessecary.

i think im going to put pressure on them to do an AST