Really confusing situation: any maths brains out there?

[Deleted User]

Hello again - and sorry if I am boring you with my posts.

Barclays have replied with their 'final response' which is incredibly interesting. They agree that they've processed things incorrectly, but are refusing to do anything because they believe I haven't lost out and have still 'received a benefit'.

Here is the full text of their response - I have put the most important points in bold for emphasis:

---

Dear Mr XXXXX

Thank you for taking the time to talk to me recently. I am sorry you needed to contact us again regarding your complaint about your Graduate Loan account. Please find set out below confirmation of the details of our discussion and our Final Response to your complaint.

You have requested that an interest refund is applied to your loan account due to the refund of the Payment Protection from your original loan being made to your current account.

Your original Graduate Loan, account number XXXXXX for was [sic] £10000 and the Payment Protection was £1786.69. You made seven payments of £242.10. When your account was settled the new loan was opened at the same figure of £10000. A refund of the remaining Payment Protection on the original loan was credited to your Current Account on 2 May 2006. We have previously issued copy ledgers showing the entries to your accounts.

When a loan is closed the bank will provide a refund of the remaining Payment Protection as a rebate. It is usual to credit the rebate to the closing loan, however in this case it was credited to your current account, however you have received the rebate as evidenced by the copy ledgers and have therefore had the benefit of the funds. If you were unhappy for your new loan to start at £10000 then this should have been discussed with the branch adviser and you should not have signed the forms of agreement if you were in anyway unhappy with the new loan.

You have also raised a query with regard to the interest rate on the new loan. I confirmed in my letter dated 13 November that the rate on each loan was 7.9% APR and this is clearly stated on both sets of paperword. The resolution you are seeking is that we reduce the balance of your new loan by £1786.69 and any interest associated with portion [sic] of the loan. You request is on the basis that it should not have been taken for £10000 but for around £8220, which would have taken into account the Payment Protection rebate of £1786.69 from the previous loan.

On this occasion we are partially upholding your complaint on the basis that the branch should have passed the refund to the loan. However we are not prepared to agree to your request to reduce the debt and refund associated interest as you did receive the refund and had the benefit of the funds.

I hope this explanation is helpful and has answered all your concerns although I appreciate that it may not be the outcome you wanted.

[The letter then includes all their usual bumpf about FOS reviews, right to complain etc].

Yours sincerely,

XXXXX
Customer Relations Manager

[Deleted User]

My key gripes:

I have not 'had the benefit of the funds' - my graduate loan does not allow overpayments so although I received a refund, I couldn't use it to reduce my loan balance and so Barclays artificially inflated the compound interest rate to my detriment.

Barclays are acknowledging that they processed my loan incorrectly - could this help my cause?

I had no choice but to sign the new loan. I wasn't 'forced to take out a loan', but I was replacing an existing loan and was told in branch that I had no choice.

It would be like going into Debenhams to buy someone a Christmas present, but completely unbeknown to you the cashier deducts £200 from you card rather than the £100 they should have taken. When you ask for it back, they tell you that they can only refund it in vouchers, so although you receive a form of refund, they've still taken your money to their benefit.

marshallka

Deleted_User wrote: »

My key gripes:

I have not 'had the benefit of the funds' - my graduate loan does not allow overpayments so although I received a refund, I couldn't use it to reduce my loan balance and so Barclays artificially inflated the compound interest rate to my detriment.

Barclays are acknowledging that they processed my loan incorrectly - could this help my cause?

I had no choice but to sign the new loan. I wasn't 'forced to take out a loan', but I was replacing an existing loan and was told in branch that I had no choice.

It would be like going into Debenhams to buy someone a Christmas present, but completely unbeknown to you the cashier deducts £200 from you card rather than the £100 they should have taken. When you ask for it back, they tell you that they can only refund it in vouchers, so although you receive a form of refund, they've still taken your money to their benefit.

Hi bunglejemson, if your complaint against Barclays is actually about the new loan and not to do with the PPI misselling then the loan would have had to have been taken out since April, 2007 for the use of the FOS in the complaint.

Have they refunded ALL the PPI back then or just a rebate against it? DId you make the complaint for misselling also?

[Deleted User]

Oh really?

The new loan took effect March 2006 - and the complaint is really to do with that.

So, where do I go if the FOS is not an option? I must say I haven't seen any details anywhere (even of the FOS website or when I called them) to say that the loan had to be post-2007.

Regarding the refund, it's really complicated and I thought I understood it, but clearly didn't.

The PPI premium was £1,786.69 at the start of the loan. They refunded £1,502 total. I originally though that this was not a refund of the PPI, but a refund of the payments I had made to the loan so far.

According to their letter though (see above), this is a refund 'of the remaining Payment Protection on the original loan', but this can't make sense, surely? Why would they 'refund' me a premium that I've yet to pay? Otherwise, it's the same as them giving me a loan of £11786.69 when I've only applied for a £10k loan.

Does that make sense? Why would they refund yet-to-be-paid PPI to me - as I haven't paid it yet?

[Deleted User]

Also, I did make a complaint about mis-selling but they keep ignoring that bit and just dealing with my 'main' complaint about how the PPI was refunded. Literally they haven't acknowledged my PPI complaint at all.

marshallka

Deleted_User wrote: »

Oh really?

The new loan took effect March 2006 - and the complaint is really to do with that.

So, where do I go if the FOS is not an option? I must say I haven't seen any details anywhere (even of the FOS website or when I called them) to say that the loan had to be post-2007.

Regarding the refund, it's really complicated and I thought I understood it, but clearly didn't.

The PPI premium was £1,786.69 at the start of the loan. They refunded £1,502 total. I originally though that this was not a refund of the PPI, but a refund of the payments I had made to the loan so far.

According to their letter though (see above), this is a refund 'of the remaining Payment Protection on the original loan', but this can't make sense, surely? Why would they 'refund' me a premium that I've yet to pay? Otherwise, it's the same as them giving me a loan of £11786.69 when I've only applied for a £10k loan.

Does that make sense? Why would they refund yet-to-be-paid PPI to me - as I haven't paid it yet?

Its here about consumer credit complaints.... although with it being Barclays (sorry thought it was a broker for some reason) it may be different as they are a bank...it may be under compulsory jurisdiction but I would ring to check but I am almost sure you should be ok with a bank
http://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/publications/ombudsman-news/60/60-ombudsman-focus.htm

marshallka

Deleted_User wrote: »

Also, I did make a complaint about mis-selling but they keep ignoring that bit and just dealing with my 'main' complaint about how the PPI was refunded. Literally they haven't acknowledged my PPI complaint at all.

Well if its over 8 weeks now since you complained about the PPI and they just ignore then go to FOS with this also. They should have addressed it and they have not so you don't need a final response but let FOS know that you have already given them 8 weeks.

Good luck and sorry about the Consumer credit complaint also. I would though make the two complaints seperate TBH as they would be under different departments at FOS but just check again on this one. Its best as you may have to write all over again.

[Deleted User]

Great - thanks for this Marshalka!

Do you think that the fact Barclays have put their hands up and said 'yes, we did process this incorrectly' will carry any weight?

I'm struggling to pinpoint a specific rule or law or regulation that they've broken: the Banking Code is very airy-fairy and talks about 'fairness' which is incredibly subjective.

I'm just writing my letter to the FOS now but prepared for them to apply legal principles and throw it out, even though I've been wronged.

marshallka

Deleted_User wrote: »

Does that make sense? Why would they refund yet-to-be-paid PPI to me - as I haven't paid it yet?

This sounds like they have actually refunded the PPI then. I am totally confused by this complaint to be absolutely honest and just hope someone else comes along to post. I just think that maybe its time for the FOS to look into it for you are you seem to be getting no where with Barclays.

marshallka

Deleted_User wrote: »

Great - thanks for this Marshalka!

Do you think that the fact Barclays have put their hands up and said 'yes, we did process this incorrectly' will carry any weight?

I'm struggling to pinpoint a specific rule or law or regulation that they've broken: the Banking Code is very airy-fairy and talks about 'fairness' which is incredibly subjective.

I'm just writing my letter to the FOS now but prepared for them to apply legal principles and throw it out, even though I've been wronged.

FOS won't just throw it out if you have lost money and been wronged by the bank and yes, I think it will go in your favour with Barclays saying they did process it incorrectly. I would just let FOS apply what they can. Its very complicated how they work and they will see you right if you have been wronged.

Good luck