What web design software do i need

isofa

Robin_T_Cox wrote: »

Nowadays most web sites are built using a Content Management System, such as Joomla or Drupal. See:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Web_content_management_system
http://www.joomla.org/about-joomla.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drupal
Both are free open source applications. Of the two, Joomla is probably the easiest to learn. There is a comparison of each here:
http://www.alledia.com/blog/general-cms-issues/joomla-and-drupal-which-one-is-right-for-you/

They are? Not in my industry. Proper design CSS, XHTML rule. :rolleyes:

I would doubt there are more than a small percentage of small business advertisting sites which are built with CMS systems, although they do have advantage if you require them.

jeggburt

I agree, it's only massive firms that tend to use content management systems.

The vast majority I've seen use basic CSS/XHTML.

The advise given by faevilangel is sound and it's how I learned HTML and CSS. The problems with these WYSIWYG software packages is if the code doesn't work, you usually don't know where to start and a basic knowledge of how the code works goes a long way.

Good luck.

isofa

TBH Serif have a poor standing in the professional world, you'd be better of saving your money and using the free http://www.kompozer.net/ which is just as powerful, or putting the cash towards a pro tool such as Dreamweaver. But it does depend on what you want to achieve, your skill and quality of output.

Publisher, Serif etc all produce inefficient, often standards non-compliant code too.

I think the problem is that anyone thinks they can be a designer, programmer, web expert etc, just because they can use a computer. (Professionals command good money, because they are trained experts. This follows on from another thread about designing commercial databases.)

It's not that simple. Good webdesigned are skilled in multi-disciplined, usually design and artwork creation (Photoshop, Illustrator etc) not only being artist and having a good grounding in user interfaces, but also understand all the technical advantages and disadvantages of file formats, compression, vector vs raster for web graphics. Then there is the web design aspect, which is a huge topic, covering everything from simple HTML, to more complex CSS, XHTML, Javascript, XML, Flash, databases with SQL, dynamic sites with PHP, ASP and so on. Often you'll find a professional is just a specialist in one field, because the whole gamut is far too much for one person to know in detail.

A bad wesbite, looks bad and projects a poor quality image of the company.

I wouldn't ask a plumber to fix my electrics and I wouldn't ask someone who could use Excel to update my website...

Richard_Wells

Try Expression Web: http://www.software4students.co.uk/Microsoft_Expression_Web_2-details.aspx

Lots of tutorials here: http://www.learnexpression.com/

Infact just google "free expression web tutorials", there are millions of websites showing you how to do prety much anything.

Perhaps the software is rather popular

Robin_T_Cox

jeggburt wrote: »

I agree, it's only massive firms that tend to use content management systems.

The vast majority I've seen use basic CSS/XHTML.

The advise given by faevilangel is sound and it's how I learned HTML and CSS. The problems with these WYSIWYG software packages is if the code doesn't work, you usually don't know where to start and a basic knowledge of how the code works goes a long way.

Good luck.

Not so. Nowadays Web designers let the computer take the strain, so that they can concentrate on design issues. There's really no need nowadays to learn HTML and CSS, because using them to construct a Web site is both too slow and too prone to error. And besides, the computer is better than you at using them. Which is why, of course, CMS was developed. After all, no-one programs in machine code any more, do they?

For example, the popular Scotsgait website is built using Joomla, and this has all been achieved by one man, TLJ.

http://www.scotsgait.co.uk/

Get on board the modern way of doing things.

Here's a clue: it doesn't include Dreamweaver.

jeggburt

Robin_T_Cox wrote: »

Get on board the modern way of doing things.

Here's a clue: it doesn't include Dreamweaver.

The problem with working in the public sector, we're always lagging behind everyone else

I like the design of that site you supplied though, especially given that one person built it - kudos to them. Unfortunately, I would probably need more than one person to aid me as I have no graphical talent at all.

isofa

Whilst there are some sites built using CMS systems, then are many, many more built without. An example against machine code simply misses the point and isn't a very accurate.

Robin_T_Cox wrote: »

There's really no need nowadays to learn HTML and CSS, because using them to construct a Web site is both too slow and too prone to error.

For a poorly skilled / lazy practitioner that is probably true, for a professional that absolute nonsense. Just looking at the job market from Computer Weekly shows the demand for proper coding skills.

Anyone using a CMS system in a good environment will still be coding CSS and HTML alongside with it, unless they want to use a set of templates with no design flair whatsoever.

Tim Berners-Lee - father of the web, his site is clean simple, and unsurprising written in highly efficient HTML: http://www.w3.org/People/Berners-Lee/

Perhaps I should also put in a quote from the W3C, the The World Wide Web Consortium, where the standards are set: HTML and CSS are the fundamental technologies for building Web pages: HTML (html and xhtml) for structure, CSS for style and layout.

Robin_T_Cox wrote: »

Which is why, of course, CMS was developed.

So much mis-information on this forum. CMS was not developed to replace simple static sites, nor is it a one stop answer to a web design requirement. CMS systems were designed to cope with constant data changes initially in larger sites, and publishing information from large groups of people with limited skills to maintain news and updates of information. It's only very recently that CMS systems have started to be used for other "simple" sites by people with limited coding experience. Joomla and Drupal are still used in the main for dynamic sites, not static sites. Still, no novice can setup a full CMS with database links and top end design, any more than one can setup a good static site without knowledge of HTML and CSS.

thebaldwindowfitter

send me a pm i may be able to put you onto somebody who can do you one like mine at a very good price and a lot less than you would think type in my user name plus .co.uk and you will understand what i mean.Believe me it takes alot of learning to do it yourself i update my site every week and that takes its time

tameem

Why you need to pay just search for free templets and you will find a lot of great designs

Robin_T_Cox

isofa wrote: »

Whilst there are some sites built using CMS systems, then are many, many more built without. An example against machine code simply misses the point and isn't a very accurate.



For a poorly skilled / lazy practitioner that is probably true, for a professional that absolute nonsense. Just looking at the job market from Computer Weekly shows the demand for proper coding skills.

Anyone using a CMS system in a good environment will still be coding CSS and HTML alongside with it, unless they want to use a set of templates with no design flair whatsoever.

Tim Berners-Lee - father of the web, his site is clean simple, and unsurprising written in highly efficient HTML: http://www.w3.org/People/Berners-Lee/

Perhaps I should also put in a quote from the W3C, the The World Wide Web Consortium, where the standards are set: HTML and CSS are the fundamental technologies for building Web pages: HTML (html and xhtml) for structure, CSS for style and layout.



So much mis-information on this forum. CMS was not developed to replace simple static sites, nor is it a one stop answer to a web design requirement. CMS systems were designed to cope with constant data changes initially in larger sites, and publishing information from large groups of people with limited skills to maintain news and updates of information. It's only very recently that CMS systems have started to be used for other "simple" sites by people with limited coding experience. Joomla and Drupal are still used in the main for dynamic sites, not static sites. Still, no novice can setup a full CMS with database links and top end design, any more than one can setup a good static site without knowledge of HTML and CSS.

Alas, the above post misses the point that what may be true for a professional (but see below) simply doesn't meet the needs of a novice who hasn't got time to become a professional, but wants to construct a web site that works, within a reasonable time, and at a modest cost.

The best way to do that, as I have said, is to use a CMS system like Joomla. Incidentally, a useful review of what's available as of today is here:

http://webdesignledger.com/tools/10-best-content-management-systems-for-designers

And any professional, who may indeed know html and css, isn't going to waste time and risk errors by hand coding when such tools are available to enable them to complete a project to specification within time and budget.