Removal of de-energised electricity meter

essentialjim

Hi all, this my 1st post here. Apologies for such a lengthy post, but I feel it is needed to 'paint the picture'.... this is all relating to my fiance and the premise that she rents for her shop for the last 2 years....

- took over the tenancy on 19th March 2007 from a private landlord. Later that year the property was taken over by another landlord and a property management company.

- At the time I took over the tenancy there were two electricity meters side by side in the meter box. I was supplied with my meter code which is jd04k02340 by the original private landlord and I proceeded to set up an account with British Gas for which I have paid by direct debit.

- Three months ago to my great surprise a representative from the meter reading services came out to read the meter not registered to me only to tell me that there was an outstanding bill of £1200 owed to Npower.

- This raised alarm bells for me and I took it upon myself to read both meters at the beginning and end of the next day. This exercise brought to my attention that my meter reading did not change but the other did.

- I contacted British Gas for them to inform me that I had only ever been paying a standing charge and my meter was in fact de-energised.

- I then contacted the Energy Ombudsman who advised that Npower and British Gas would need to do energy traces on both meters to determine who was responsible for each meter.

- The result of this trace was meter ff98k7138 supplies electricity to my property and the common areas to the adjoining flats belonging to the original private landlord. Meter jd04k02340 is de-energised but a standing charge of £50 per month still applies and for which I am currently being held responsible as two meters have been left in the property.

The property management company has relinquished responsiblity for this now after months of going back and forthe with them and not getting anywhere. They say their loyalties lay with the new landlord who has refused any assistance.

The private landlord has paid a small amount to the £1200 bill (which was his mistake but will not admit it). He is also saying that he will not pay for the de-energised meter to be removed, which British Gas have said needs to be done now for the standing charge to be stopped (of which we can't understand why there is one when the meter is de-enrgised!!).

The private landlord also wants the meter that is powered by N-Power to continue supplying the common areas for his flats above the shop and he will pay 'what he thinks he owes' as and when!!

British Gas are still billing my girlfriend for this £50 monthly standing charge for the de-energised meter - information that they have supplied my fiance has never been consistent and the last person she spoke to said 'no problem' I will get someone out to remove the meter. That was yesterday - no one turned up and following another converstaion they have said that it was wrong information given!

I would be grateful if anyone can offer some advice because my fiance is literally at her wits end - she is having sleepless nights, breaking down in tears and is stressed to the point where she does not know where to turn. The following are the key issues I think:

- The separation of the power supply to the adjoining properties.
- To be released from the responsibility of the standing charge for the de-energised meter.
- The removal of the de-energised meter - ultimately.
- Reimbursement for the electricity supplied and standing charges for the last 28 months to the said adjoining properties.

She would get the meter removed asap but currently can't afford too. British Gas have quoted her nearly £200 for the pleasure!! Advice has been sort from The Energy Ombudsman and Trading Standards and no one is being of any help!

Any advice would be appreciated.

Thanks

James

ex-energywatch_adviser

The main problem here is that you can't do anything with the meters without the landlord's permission so you will have to go through the tenancy agreement and probably get some legal advice as to where you stand. The suppliers will not get involved in this as it is between you and your landlord.

I would also advise you to speak to the Meter Point Administration Service (MPAS) directly on 0845 330 0889 as there are some anomilies with the meter serial numbers that require further investigation, for example the JD Meter Serial Number is not de-energised and is in a property with an LS postcode but the FF MSN is registered at five different properties with HU postcodes.

essentialjim

Thanks for the response - I made a mistake with MSN no. It is actually ff98k71738 and I have justdouble checked it with MPAS and it is correctly only supplying that property.

A lot of head ache with all of this but hopefully after speaking to British Gas yesterday they are going to de-energise the jd meter for free as a good will gesture.... we shall see though!

Thanks for the advice though, next step is to get a meeting with the Private Landlord that gave out the wrong meter no.

spiro

There is another option going forward. You say your meter is connected to your area and the communal areas of the flats above. You also say there is a de-energised meter doing nothing. Both meters near each other so contact the landlord and say you want the supply for the flats transferred onto the spare meter (which probably only needs a new fuse in to energise it) which he will then be 100% responsible for and you will have your own meter. I'm guessing that flats are on a seperate consumer unit to you so this should not be too difficult. If the landlord wont pay his share of the bill you could always threaten to cut him off especially if they come off your consumer unit or you could deduct a resonable amount from the rent. There are also laws about electricity metering and landlords but this is normally were he has to account for what you use, why not turn this on its head and claim he is using 100% and you are using nothing without a meter he cannot prove who is right and therefore is on dodgy legal grounds.

Haarlem

Your case is quite confusing.

Who has told you the meter is "De-energised"? This term is an industry one where the distribution company has been told the supply is no longer required at the moment and the cut out fuses have been withdrawn so electricity cannot be used, but there is a possibility that the supply point may be required in the future. The suggestion of possible future use usually comes from the owners of the property being supplied.

Distribution companies are uaually keen to remove a supply point completely if it is definately not to be used again as it is a potential danger to anyone tampering with it.

Mankysteve

I think you need to move out ASAP. You need to find a new landlord. Even when you've sort this out he's gonna keep messing you around. Also a trip to citizen advice as well.

tripled

Hi essentialjim,

Firstly I'm an ex BG residential callcentre worker - I worked there from 2003 - 2007 so that covers the start of the problem you're raising.

BG abolished standing charges for residential customers somewhere around the late 90's/early naughties (used to know the exact year, but forgotten it now). So, you haven't been paying a standing charge. I believe BG have now re-introduced one recently on some pre-payment tariffs, but no comapny I've heard of, including BG, charge anything like a £50 per month standing charge for residential customers. I'm not disputing you've been paying money to them, just that this mythical standing charge you've been told about is rubbish, unless the meter could be on a business tariff for some reason (i never worked in business so couldn't be 100% sure, however it seems highly unlikely).

Disconnecting the 'de-energised' meter is not your problem either - it doesn't supply your property, it isn't your responsibility. It's a red herring, it is irrelevant whether it's connected or not as long as it isn't supplying your property. I assume the meter reading still hasn't changed and yours has.

So, where do you go from here? First, you need to confirm the correct meter to your property (it looks like you have already done this, but double check - are you sre the meter you checked isn't one for a different flat?). Then, call your area MPAS service (look in the front of your yellow pages or post back here to ask) and give them the serial number to confirm who supplies the meter.

This is where it can get complicated, but assuming MPAS confirm nPower supply your meter, call BG and tell them that you have been paying the bill for the incorrect meter (yes, go through it again), give them the correct meter serial number for your address and get them to backdate and close the incorrect account (when I worked there it would have to be the homemovers dept that would deal with this, so I'd recommend ringing that number). Problem is, your luck rides on getting an experienced agent who will deal with the case and process it (I was one of the ones who would, but I'd need to be happy your story matched up before I did an action on the system that resulted in a several hundred pound refund).

If they won't help, demand to speak to their line manger and go through the rigmarole again. Make sure you mention if this isn't sorted out you are going to complain to the Ombudsman and write to your MP/Watchdog/The Local Rag (MP, Ombudsman/Energywatch and Media were key words in my day to trigger the complaint process).

If you still haven't got anywhere, follow it up with a written letter of complaint (Cardew will probably advise going straight to the written letter, but if you can sort things out over the phone it's better). This should be sent recorded delivery. If/when this doesn't work, then you need to take it to the obudsman.

Eventaully, if all is well and good, eventually BG will refund your money, at which point you will need to pay nPower for what you have used. This could be more or less than what you paid BG depending on consumption/tariff, so be prepared to pay their bill and more - although you may end up paying less (hope for the best, plan for the worst).

You may have a difficult road ahead of you, but although I don't look at these forums often on here any more, there are a few people who know what they're talking about, so post for advice as you go along and I'm sure they'll help. Also ignore the flippant 'just move' or 'tell them to stuff it' comments you'll get because they won't help.

All the best

spiro

tripled wrote: »

Hi essentialjim,

BG abolished standing charges for residential customers somewhere around the late 90's/early naughties (used to know the exact year, but forgotten it now). So, you haven't been paying a standing charge. I believe BG have now re-introduced one recently on some pre-payment tariffs, but no comapny I've heard of, including BG, charge anything like a £50 per month standing charge for residential customers. I'm not disputing you've been paying money to them, just that this mythical standing charge you've been told about is rubbish, unless the meter could be on a business tariff for some reason (i never worked in business so couldn't be 100% sure, however it seems highly unlikely).

The original post mentions 'shop' therefore it is possible that the £50pm is a business rate.

Mankysteve

May i add when I said move out this would not be solution to the bills as you'll still owe the money and get chased down for it. But you landlord saying things like ill pay you what I feel like and when. This is clearly not the behaviour of decent landlord and you should run a mile.