That old chesnut of the FTB house

edgex

Really2 wrote: »

But perhaps we can conclude that the bears have now given up on 3.5X the average single wage (around £25k) as a basis of house prices.

what sort of average is that though?

£25k is realistically nowhere near what most people earn
you can get qualified accountants for £20k!


i would base it on 3X £20k = £60k
not £87.5k+

wacking 31% less

boyse7en

JonnyBravo wrote: »

You may be right in that many couples are in the stats but of course there will be lots of singles too. Indeed if the majority were couples..... lets say 60% then 40% would be singles..... obviously, I hear you say, but follow it through....
If that were the case (admittedly that 60/40 split is off the top of my head, just as your supposition that most are couples is off the top of your head) then the average wage comes out at £23,125.
(A long way from the straight average you seem to be implying of £37k/2 = £18.5k)

That's the thing with averages Graham, just cos lots of people might earn £18k in your experience, or just cos a majority might be couples, the average can be very different.
You know the obvious one of the average numbers of arms for the people of the UK is less than 2 etc.

Interesting things averages.

Well, ok mildly interesting..... sort of.....

p.s. Yes, I know I've used "average" and meant "mean" all the way through

But presumably the singles will be buying houses (on average) at prices less than £143k, while the couples will be buying slightly larger houses above the £143k average for FTBs.

That's the thing about averages, none of the buying prices has to match the average for the average to be accurate.

(and when I say average, obviously I mainly mean mean)

Graham_Devon

boyse7en wrote: »

But presumably the singles will be buying houses (on average) at prices less than £143k, while the couples will be buying slightly larger houses above the £143k average for FTBs.

That's the thing about averages, none of the buying prices has to match the average for the average to be accurate.

(and when I say average, obviously I mainly mean mean)

Johnny hasn't grasped averages yet

lostinrates

Mr_Matey wrote: »

How comparable are FTB "average homes" over time?[/QUOTE

Yes, very true.

Really2

edgex wrote: »

what sort of average is that though?

£25k is realistically nowhere near what most people earn
you can get qualified accountants for £20k!


i would base it on 3X £20k = £60k
not £87.5k+

wacking 31% less

I don't think a CIMA qualified accountant with job experience would be on £20K

A AAT qualified accounts Clerk maybe. (but I believe that is over £26K average after stage 3)

Cleaver

edgex wrote: »

£25k is realistically nowhere near what most people earn
you can get qualified accountants for £20k!

£25k is realistically pretty near what average people earn, according to most stats.

And if you're a qualified accountant earning £20k then you're not very good at it, working for an awful company or not very ambitious.

JonnyBravo

boyse7en wrote: »

But presumably the singles will be buying houses (on average) at prices less than £143k, while the couples will be buying slightly larger houses above the £143k average for FTBs.

That's the thing about averages, none of the buying prices has to match the average for the average to be accurate.

(and when I say average, obviously I mainly mean mean)

Yes!

And by that stick, the couples will be paying more and earning more than the average of £37k......

What's your point?

Just to clarify for all hard of learning here is my point spelt out in slow motion.


If the average income that buys a FTB property is £37k, even if only 40% of them are bought by a single... and a full 50% more than that ie 60% are bought by couples it brings the average wage of those involved up to £23,125.

A full 25% higher than if they were all couples where the average would be £18.5k.

JonnyBravo

Graham_Devon wrote: »

Johnny hasn't grasped averages yet

:rotfl:

That's rich. You thought it mattered what the split of that £37k was between the two earners in a couple was when determining the mean.

Graham hasn't grasped that I have grasped averages and he hasn't.


Next.

edgex

Really2 wrote: »

I don't think a CIMA qualified accountant with job experience would be on £20K

A AAT qualified accounts Clerk maybe. (but I believe that is over £26K average after stage 3)

Cleaver wrote: »

£25k is realistically pretty near what average people earn, according to most stats.

And if you're a qualified accountant earning £20k then you're not very good at it, working for an awful company or not very ambitious.

i had the salary scales recently
AAT stage 3 isnt £26k

currently on Reed in Birmingham:
(ACA/CIMA/ACCA) Management Accountant £25k
AAT Qualified Asst Management Accnt £18k


London & south-east salaries make a mess of the averages



even if you then take £25k
X3 = £75k
thats still 14% off what people had been basing property values on

Really2

edgex wrote: »

i had the salary scales recently
AAT stage 3 isnt £26k

currently on Reed in Birmingham:
(ACA/CIMA/ACCA) Management Accountant £25k
AAT Qualified Asst Management Accnt £18k


London & south-east salaries make a mess of the averages



even if you then take £25k
X3 = £75k
thats still 14% off what people had been basing property values on

Stage 3 qualified AAT 1 year experience was £26K 4-5 years ago (I know I did it )

A CIMA qualified with 1 year+ experience you are looking at £40K+

You are talking fresh out of college no experience, they aint your average accountant, they will be employed at a junior level until proven.

Your point is for stating at no experience, that is the same for all jobs. But that is not the average wage for the job.

To prove my point.
CIMA £35K - £85K
http://www.jobsite.co.uk/cgi-bin/advsearch?search_type=quick&location_within=20&fp_skill_include=cima&location_include=&annual_hourlyreqd_salary_low=annual&reqd_salary_low=ANY&reqd_salary_high=ANY&jobtype=E&daysback=7

AAT (the only full qualified experience seem to be audit) £30K ish
http://www.jobsite.co.uk/cgi-bin/advsearch?search_type=quick&location_within=10&fp_skill_include=aat&location_include=&daysback=7