Freegle (Formerly Freecycle) - Issues?

newsgroup_monkey

So we all know that Freecycle for some people is no more and in a lot of areas the group has been renamed Freegle.

That's all fine - I would like to know why, but that's another story.

The big issue for me is that it still should be called "Free-Loaders"

Is anything being done for the people who constantly sit at their PCs waiting for someone to post it so that they can "claim" it within seconds?

I've got stories galore about people who freeload, never offer anything, grab as much as they can so they can "Car Boot" it and generally make it miserable for people who are in need. Not to mention those who lie about their situation.

I hate doing it because of the volume of mail, but I often do a check to ensure that the right person gets something.

wehavethepower

This is the reason why it changed to Freegle - we got this email:

The main reason for our move is simple. While Freecycle is a GREAT idea, all our UK groups were basically forced to work under a system devised in and for the United States. Leaders of Freecycle in the UK spent more than two years talking with the main Freecycle Network trying to get the freedom to run things in a way more suited to our own country and our own laws. Nothing changed.

In July four leading members of our National UK Freecycle team resigned. Moderators around the country then formed an Independent Association of Freecycle Moderators and again tried talks with The Freecycle Network. But again to no avail.

Since then an increasing number of Group Owners and Moderators have been SUMMARILY DISMISSED from Freecycle including the former UK Director of Freecycle UK.

So we have decided to go our own way.

---

We have received many emails from members who are very supportive, and other emails from members who want a bit more information on why wh had to move the group so quickly away from the Freecycle banner.

This decision was NOT taken lightly, and had the support of the whole mod team.

What members have been shielded from is an immense power struggle in the Freecycle organisation. We in the UK were being dictated to by just two people in the US. We wanted just a little autonomy in the UK to adjust some of the minor rules to fit local custom. We were also part of a UK charity but the directors were diverting the money (not a lot) to the US fund. No one as paid in the UK. Every one works voluntarily and expenses were never reimbursed however one director was paying themselves a salary. Anyone who questioned where the money was going or the imposed 'unwritten rules' (which changed as much as the wind did) were dismissed without counsel. It made no difference how much time you had given freely to the organisation. You were dispensable.

We as individual group owners were further shielded from what was happening further up the UK arm of the org by some very dedicated and long term members. In the end they (4 of them) resigned on mass as a protest. This included the UK director. It was only after the resignations that we got to see what was truly going on and the confidential information flowed out to the group owners.
The abuse we were suffering was beyond belief! In an attempt to show our feelings a very high proportion of UK owners and moderators formed an association in which we democratically elected 7 very trustworthy people to represent us in negotiations with the remaining 2 US board of directors. They failed to even acknowledge our existence! On the odd occasion where engagement took place and were very specific questions asked they avoided the subject and rambled on about something completely irrelevant.

What followed was a absolute disgrace! A new person promoted onto the board of directors was never elected. The resigning UK director was publicly removed from the organisation swiftly followed by anyone who had asked any awkward questions. This included the seven people who we, in the UK, elected to be our voice, and over 30 group owners, including from this group. This number continues growing. Needless to say this has sent shock waves through the dedicated owners here in the UK. It was therefore agreed by many that we could no longer maintain any relationship with a dictatorship organisation.

The outcome is we had to remove all wording that linked us the former
organisation i.e. Freecycle(R). Failure to do that would have meant Freecycle's trade mark people would have instructed Yahoo to remove the group without warning.

From our members point of view nothing has changed and in general nothing will. WE WILL remain a group dedicated to keeping tangible items out of landfill by gifting, and WE WILL remain a comminuty for local people.

This all happened in an exceedingly short period of time. In order to stand on our own in a united way we needed a name. All UK moderators and group owners were invited to make suggestions. Many were very good but could not be used as they infringed on other organisations or were not available as a top level domain name. We had two separate votes in a period of 24 hours. The name needed to be simple and could be used as a verb. It has been agreed that we would review the name in the near future and, if necessary, change it to a much better name.

In the emails we have had from our members, the word Freecycling was used several times. If we used that word anywhere on our site we would have been instructed to remove it in no uncertain terms. If we didn't then we would have been considered troublesome and been delisted from Freecycle.org. Following that we would get an order to remove all copyright material and change our name. If we did not we would have been issued a Cease and Desist order. If we still made no change our group would be removed from Yahoo.
That is a prime example of how we were being treated.
I'm sure more of this will come out in the press over the next few days.

Please understand, if we had the opportunity we would have consulted the membership, but we had no choice. The only option we had was to just get on with it.

I hope this puts this into perspective.

There is an article in the guardian about this, not fully explanatory, but good all the same. It should be noted that in the article, Nan and the rest of the Freecycle leadership in the USA were very aware of exactly what was going on here in the UK, even though they deny it.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/green-living-blog/2009/sep/10/uk-freecycle-us-network

Kind regards, and thanks again for being part of this fantastic group.

jt64

newsgroup_monkey wrote: »

The big issue for me is that it still should be called "Free-Loaders"

Is anything being done for the people who constantly sit at their PCs waiting for someone to post it so that they can "claim" it within seconds?

I've got stories galore about people who freeload, never offer anything, grab as much as they can so they can "Car Boot" it and generally make it miserable for people who are in need. Not to mention those who lie about their situation.

I hate doing it because of the volume of mail, but I often do a check to ensure that the right person gets something.

But why should you care? Freecycle/Freegle is not about giving to the needy so you can feel good about your gifting, it's about ensuring things that are useful to someone don't end up in landfill simply because they're useless to you. Admittedly people should not lie if they intend to sell an item on but to be honest I never ask what they intend to do with it, good luck to them, I'm simply happy to have had someone relieve me of my unwanted items and save me the hassle (and expense and petrol) of a trip to the tip.

Jon.

piratefairy

I agree, I have listed a few things, unwanted furniture mainly which had been donated to me when I moved, and was amazed that I had responses within minutes!! I waited and picked a person at random, who by her email was "desperate" but then didn't bother to turn up. So randomly chose someone else..No problems there, but any time I email to ask about something I am told it was gone immediately.

veganline

Freegle still has the same problem. It prevents more automated communication systems like Vskips or Letsallshare catching-on. (there's a list of some rivals in The Guardian) It retains a system of bossy wardens with their junk mail and ever-changing rules about how to post. This reduces recycling because people don't want to volunteer to boss others about and those who do get tired and puzzled. I suppose the same applies to other Yahoo-group based groups on another thread.

This what one richmond on thames freecycle volunteer had to say on the subject of including a link to a photograph of a cooker with a slightly techie description. I had posted several messages with links to photos before. Or maybe it was a link to google map reference. He thought it was techie anyway.

Does it win a prize for pettiest, nastiest freecycle/freegle note or has anyone got a better one?

Chill - if you could repost without the external link it'd go up.

Links are not allowed for reasons I'd have thought you bright enough to understand, given your techie status alluded to in your post below - we have kids that use this group and at the same time idiots who find it funny to spoof links to weird !!!! (not often thankfully but it still happens) - now, we don't have the time to check 'em, but we do give a damn - so we politely ask that folk don't post links. This is in the rules, if you had read them maybe you would have avoided this mistake ?

Is that not simple enough to avoid getting abuse from you after a polite request to desist ? [sic]

Go get a life/and or another group - your choice - your posting rights on this group have been removed until you apologise for your remarks below.

chocsessential

Blimey, how rude. What an obnoxious jobsworth (who's obviously jealous of your techie expertise).

Soubrette

Chill - if you could repost without the external link it'd go up.

Links are not allowed for reasons I'd have thought you bright enough to understand, given your techie status alluded to in your post below - we have kids that use this group and at the same time idiots who find it funny to spoof links to weird !!!! (not often thankfully but it still happens) - now, we don't have the time to check 'em, but we do give a damn - so we politely ask that folk don't post links. This is in the rules, if you had read them maybe you would have avoided this mistake ?

Is that not simple enough to avoid getting abuse from you after a polite request to desist ? [sic]

Go get a life/and or another group - your choice - your posting rights on this group have been removed until you apologise for your remarks below.

What were "your remarks below"?

Sou

veganline

Soubrette wrote: »

What were "your remarks below"?

Have you nothing better to do?

Dear Member,

This is an automatically generated email from Richmond Upon Thames Freecycle (R).

Please remove external URL web links from your post and resubmit - we are not allowed to approve posts containing external links on this group. You may use the Photos section on the left hand side of our homepage to post pictures of your item.
Many thanks,
The Moderators

This grey metal tower computer has been passed-around for parts.
I'm probably the last to have it before the tip, but a floppy drive, transformer & fan look use-able as well as the box itself.

There is a broken-looking mother board and some other circuit boards slotted into it as well.

http://maps.google.co.uk/? ie=UTF8&ll=51.465902,-0.258762&spn=0.009772,0.013089&z=16

Fair Offer Policy: I agree to take a period of time to see what
responses I get before deciding who to give item(s) to. This gives
members on Daily Digest, or those who don't have continual access tothe Internet a fair chance to reply.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The message above: "still the same problem" is word for word what I got.


The background quotes in this email are word-for-word what posted and got from someone called [EMAIL="richfc_mod_02@yahoo.co.uk"]richfc_mod_02@yahoo.co.uk[/EMAIL] who may have a beard but I don't know.

I think if all freegle, freecycle and other yahoo group recycling moderaters just stopped, then more automated systems of communicating offers and wants are ready to take over. I tried using a Firefox plug-in that's meant to work with freegle but I think it's got me sacked again by revealing my ID! A pity because I'm just recycling a broken bicycle and have to ask my partner to do it for me. I've had a couple of takers already. The idea of communicating wants and offers is great and works surprisingly well except for the problem of crabby moderators who keep sending emails about

• how they have caught a spammer
• polling opinions about how to deal with those who might have mis-described gifts
• don't realise why someone slightly drunk or stressed or rude as themselves might object to mail interception
• might not have read all their dozen changes of rules (or the reverse when they are bluffing)

I suspect part of the reason for volunteers breaking-away (which is fine) is that they don't want to be told that they're rude (which is not fine). Going further, they should be automated-away.

I will happily pay a tenner to the first person who shows a ruder quote from yahoo recycling group moderators this June 2010.

Adapazari

I agree that there is a problem whereby some people never appear to offer anything and there are those that do abuse the site for their own personal gain. However, thinking about it, I know that I have, on several occasions, replied to "wanted" posts and given items that way. So, whilst a member may appear not to "offer", they could actually be giving.

It's nice to have a detailed account of the reasons behind the changes. I had heard on the grapevine that part of the problem was that some members were offering livestock, which I am against.

I was a member of two groups, one covers the area where I live and one the areawhere I work. The group near my home became a Freegle group whilst the other one remains Freecycle. I withdrew from the Freecycle group for two reasons: 1) They advertised pets; 2) They allowed certain members to post long lists of "wanted" items relating to electrical goods, clearly wanted for business purposes.

I also withdrew from the Freegle, admittedly in the heat of the moment. I had wanted some advice on how to change my email address and a moderator obliged. I followed the instruction, only to receive a very sarcastic comment from another moderator because I had not advised the correct department. It really annoyed me, but , as I say, I probably cut my nose off to spite my face.