Can a cheque guarantee card be declined?

bargains83

Tootsie_Roll wrote:

Like I said - just because you get away with it most of the time doesn't make it right.

So what is the 'right' use of a cheque card then?

sunflower_2

erm... so that the person accepting the cheque are guaranteed to receive their money ?

shouldnt really have anything to do with the customer having no money in the bank

i know its prob wrong - but if i see someone paying by cheque instead of the debit card i automatically presume they dont have the money in the account yet....

bargains83

sunflower wrote:

erm... so that the person accepting the cheque are guaranteed to receive their money ?

In which case they would just use their debit card, why go to the trouble of writing a cheque?. I can't think of one place which accepts a cheque card but doesn't take debit cards.

i know its prob wrong - but if i see someone paying by cheque instead of the debit card i automatically presume they dont have the money in the account yet....

Which is exactly the right assumption, it would say to me that either the money isn't in the account right now or they have other plans for the money in the account at that time and thats why they want the retailer to take payment later. It can be the only reason, otherwise again, why would you use Cheque Guarantee over debit card?.

Using cheque card in this way cannot be fraud/deceptive, as people are saying as its the only benefit of using one!.

sparkle84

Tootsie_Roll wrote:

What's the difference between illegal and unlawful ?
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One's where you break the law, the other's a sick bird Boom Boom

Actually there isn't a difference surely ?

Mikeyorks - don't know where you get your information from but with 20 years experience in the banking world I would say you are the one that is wrong. Firstly, as stated it is fraud to write a cheque knowing there are no funds in the account to pay it. Secondly, it is exactly this sort of behaviour that banks would class as misuse and they could withdraw the card.

Sunflower - you are spot on.

I thought you had 20 years experience debt collecting Tootsie not banking!!!!

Tootsie_Roll

sparkle84 wrote:

I thought you had 20 years experience debt collecting Tootsie not banking!!!!

So banks can't collect their own money ?

Odyssy

bargains83 wrote:

. . . it would say to me that either the money isn't in the account right now or they have other plans for the money in the account at that time and thats why they want the retailer to take payment later. !.

I find that vaguely insulting.

I use cheques with the guarantee card all the time for sums of £30 - £40 upwards, and have done for years, because I don't like debit cards and never trusted the chip & pin system (with good reason, in light of the recent revelations). For smaller sums, I've never found that anyone refuses cash. I will occasionally use a credit card for items over £100 purely for the protection it provides.

For a long time now I've been a great believer in the saying 'if it's not written down, it didn't happen'. It's all too easy to lose or not even keep the debit slip if you use plastic, as long as you fill in the stub when you write the cheque, you know where you spent the money.

You know where you are with paper, sorry if I sound like a luddite, but paying with cash is 'real' - even writing a cheque removes some of the reality. One of the most painful things I ever had to do was pay over £1000 income tax IN CASH, counting the £20's out over the counter really hurt!

Whereas plastic removes the pain even further, you swipe the card, press the keys, it's not money at all.

I'm sure that's why so many younger people get into financial difficulty - the plastic distances them from the cold financial facts.

sheena4711

I agree that the cheque guarantee system is a sham. I'm a cashier for a large supermarket chain and we frequently get faxes through informing us of cheques which have been used as payment by customers and have bounced when they've reached the bank. This means that we don't receive the money, even though all procedures at the checkout were followed correctly and a cheque guarantee card was produced at the time of the transaction. If there were no funds in the account when the cheque was presented to the bank, they're going to refer that cheque to drawer which means it becomes a bad debt which the customer is not liable for. The banks instructions are for us to speak to the drawer but when you work for a busy supermarket it's not always easy to do so.

MarkyMarkD

Sheena

The bank CANNOT refer to drawer a guaranteed cheque, unless the terms of the guarantee were breached by the retailer.

That's the point of the "guarantee".

If the cheque was over the guarantee amount, or the signature doesn't match the bank's records, or the card had expired, or whatever ... then the guarantee doesn't apply and the cheque can be referred to retailer (i.e. bounced).

As for the discussion of fraudulent/illegal, it is certainly a breach of any bank's terms and conditions to write a cheque without having funds in the account AT THAT TIME (or an authorised o/d limit to cover it).

Nothing annoys me more than standing in queues at shops behind people paying by cheque, guaranteeing it with their debit card. I can't wait until cheques clear right away, or the retailers stop accepting archaic SLOW cheques.

Coupon-mad

MarkyMarkD wrote:

Sheena

I used to work for HSBC and Alliance & Leicester for many years. Totally agree with this quote from MarkyMarkD:

The bank CANNOT refer to drawer a guaranteed cheque, unless the terms of the guarantee were breached by the retailer.

That's the point of the "guarantee".

If the cheque was over the guarantee amount, or the signature doesn't match the bank's records, or the card had expired, or whatever ... then the guarantee doesn't apply and the cheque can be referred to retailer (i.e. bounced).

But I disagree with those that are saying something like the following:

As for the discussion of fraudulent/illegal, it is certainly a breach of any bank's terms and conditions to write a cheque without having funds in the account AT THAT TIME (or an authorised o/d limit to cover it).

QUOTE]

Mikeyorks, I totally agree with all your points, you seem to know what you are talking about in spite of others' reactions. There is nothing wrong with writing a cheque that you know you have the funds to honour (albeit not yet in the cheque account). It is the day the cheque debits from the account that matters (the Bank will only look at the date it was written if they were going to return it, otherwise there would not be such individual scrutiny).

When I worked for a branch of HSBC I used to keep any savings in my high-interest account until the very day cheques and payments would be debited (as staff you could find these details, also had to be very organised to remember dates of DDs etc). Then I would do a transfer of sufficient funds that day. To begin with, I used to get phone calls from Head Office to let me know I was about to become overdrawn (against the rules for staff at that time) - but they soon stopped when I always replied that I had already transferred funds and didn't need their phone call, thanks.

There was no question that I was doing anything illegal - there was no misuse of my cheque card. Indeed, there are now some accounts that offer the service of keeping your savings in your highest-interest account until the last possible day...it makes financial sense to me.:o

Lucymiss

What about shops like Cash Generator who do the PAYDAY Advances? You can cash upto £600 with approval from Transfax? They bank your cheque in 28 day's time or you can delay it and do a rollover:j

They do charge about £13 for this but you could borrow £600 that day and not have that in your bank account:rotfl: