6 years - Lloyds TSB question

athewitt

Hi there,
I have tried claiming back from Lloyds TSB the PPI from my graduate loan. Loan was taken out in 2000, and I paid it off about 3 years ago. The basis of my case is that I was a student when I took the loan out and they knew this. Therefore there was no way that the insurance was relevant to me. I was also unclear about what the insurance was, the fact it was optional, and various other problems, but the undeniable fact is that I was not employed when the PPI was taken out.

Lloyds TSB have written back with a long legal sounding letter which seems to say that because it is over 6 years since the PPI was taken out they will not pay. However - I was paying for this including the insurance up until about 3 years ago.

Any advice much appreciated.

Many thanks,

Andrew

marshallka

athewitt wrote: »

Hi there,
I have tried claiming back from Lloyds TSB the PPI from my graduate loan. Loan was taken out in 2000, and I paid it off about 3 years ago. The basis of my case is that I was a student when I took the loan out and they knew this. Therefore there was no way that the insurance was relevant to me. I was also unclear about what the insurance was, the fact it was optional, and various other problems, but the undeniable fact is that I was not employed when the PPI was taken out.

Lloyds TSB have written back with a long legal sounding letter which seems to say that because it is over 6 years since the PPI was taken out they will not pay. However - I was paying for this including the insurance up until about 3 years ago.

Any advice much appreciated.

Many thanks,

Andrew

Were you ever working part time during the time you were paying the PPI?

If you were not then they can ask for NI records to be sent in proving this but they wrongly state that because the insurance is over 6 years old they will not look into the complaint. I would ask them for their final response and then take the complaint to the FOS.

mangle101

I dont really get this! If you were mis-sold then you were mis-sold end of story, i have just successfully claimed back PPI from HSBC on various loans that i have had going back to 1999.

If Lloyds TSB are not listening to you, send a letter of complaint to FOS with copies of all of the letters & proof of postage & let them bring Lloyds TSB to book.

maxdp

mangle101 wrote: »

I dont really get this! If you were mis-sold then you were mis-sold end of story, i have just successfully claimed back PPI from HSBC on various loans that i have had going back to 1999.

If Lloyds TSB are not listening to you, send a letter of complaint to FOS with copies of all of the letters & proof of postage & let them bring Lloyds TSB to book.

Were your HSBC loans re financed Loans and how long did you take them over?

PaulinWeston

mangle101 wrote: »

I dont really get this! If you were mis-sold then you were mis-sold end of story, i have just successfully claimed back PPI from HSBC on various loans that i have had going back to 1999.

I absolutely agree - If Lloyds are trying to say that it is "time barred" then they are incorrect:

The Limitation Act 1980. Section 32 deals with postponement of the limitation period in case of fraud, concealment or mistake. It reads:
(1) Subject to subsections (3) and (4A) below, where in the case of any action for which a period of limitation is prescribed by this Act, either:
(a) the action is based upon the fraud of the defendant; or
(b) any fact relevant to the plaintiff’s right of action has been deliberately concealed from him by the defendant; or
(c) the action is for relief from the consequences of a mistake;
The period of limitation shall not begin to run until the plaintiff has discovered the fraud, concealment or mistake (as the case may be) or could with reasonable diligence have discovered it.

This means that the six year period starts from the point that you noticed the mistake - NOT (as LLoyds are trying to argue) the date of the agreement..

This definition of ‘mistake’ [Section 32 (c)] was then clarified in the House of Lords in Kleinwort Benson v Lincoln City Council [1998] UKHL 38. The House of Lords changed the law of mistake so that 'ignorance of the law' is now no longer 'no excuse' (i.e ignorance IS an excuse because you were mistaken into believing that you had been correctly sold the PPI and did not discover "the mistake" until later).

Lord Goff concluded his speech with the words: “I would therefore conclude on Issue (1) that the mistake of law rule should no longer be maintained as part of English law, and that English law should now recognise that there is a general right to recover money paid under a mistake, whether of fact or law, subject to the defences available in the law of restitution.”

The effect of the decision is, as Lord Hoffman pointed out, that the Limitation Act 1980 can now operate to extend the limitation period in cases of mistake of law. This means that the limitation will only now run from the date of your knowledge of mistake.

In addition, Section 32 (b) of the Limitation Act 1980 deals with postponement of the limitation period in case of fraud and concealment. If the company concealed any facts (ie limitations of what the PPI covers etc) then again - the 6 year period only starts from the time you discovered the deception!

Notwithstanding any of the above - the FOS published figures for the first 6 months of 2009 showing that it upheld 98% of all PPI complaints agsinst LLoyds TSB!!

mangle101

Were your HSBC loans re financed Loans and how long did you take them over?

I believe that several of the loans were taken out to pay off the balance of the last one & the loans were mainly for a period of 48 months.

athewitt

Firstly my thanks for the quality and speed of responses - much appreciated.

marshallka wrote: »

Were you ever working part time during the time you were paying the PPI?

If you were not then they can ask for NI records to be sent in proving this but they wrongly state that because the insurance is over 6 years old they will not look into the complaint. I would ask them for their final response and then take the complaint to the FOS.

No - I was not working part time at any time during the policy life. At the point when the policy was initially taken out I was a student/unemployed, and then subsequently got a job and have been full time empolyed since.

mangle101 wrote: »

I dont really get this! If you were mis-sold then you were mis-sold end of story, i have just successfully claimed back PPI from HSBC on various loans that i have had going back to 1999.

So it seems that the date of initiation of the loan and insurance are not relevant based on your experience - rather the fact that something was mis-sold.

PaulinWeston wrote: »

.....This means that the six year period starts from the point that you noticed the mistake - NOT (as LLoyds are trying to argue) the date of the agreement..

.....Notwithstanding any of the above - the FOS published figures for the first 6 months of 2009 showing that it upheld 98% of all PPI complaints agsinst LLoyds TSB!!

Wow - useful post. So basically Lloyds are wrong in their representation of the law. Also it seems like regardless - if I was to complain to the FOS I would very likely win in any case!

So - next steps? Do I write back to Lloyds asking if that is their final position - pointing out why they are wrong? Or do I just go straight to the FOS?

Again thanks for the responses.

Andrew

marshallka

athewitt wrote: »

Firstly my thanks for the quality and speed of responses - much appreciated.



No - I was not working part time at any time during the policy life. At the point when the policy was initially taken out I was a student/unemployed, and then subsequently got a job and have been full time empolyed since.



So it seems that the date of initiation of the loan and insurance are not relevant based on your experience - rather the fact that something was mis-sold.



Wow - useful post. So basically Lloyds are wrong in their representation of the law. Also it seems like regardless - if I was to complain to the FOS I would very likely win in any case!

So - next steps? Do I write back to Lloyds asking if that is their final position - pointing out why they are wrong? Or do I just go straight to the FOS?

Again thanks for the responses.

Andrew

You do need a final response in it to take to the FOS or it be 8 weeks since first complaining. Some companies are asking for longer than 8 weeks in which case you basically have a choice of waiting or going straight to FOS.

How the limitations act works is that you have 6 years to make a complaint. They can also use a 3 year rule whereby this is from you should have reasonably been aware of the complaint BUT there is also a part in the act (section 32 i think) whereby it says that if you have only just become aware of whatever it is your complaining about these 6 years and 3 years can be overuled and FOS takes pretty much the same view. We have all only just become aware we could complain about such things cause of the media attention. Having said that though, where FOS is concerned it still works on the jurisdiction of complaints although banks were always regulated so you will be OK.