Is it illegal to watch movies online?

[Deleted User]

tweeter wrote: »

Governments only standpoint is that they will support bankers to the exclusion of peoples needs - pace the cuts to come. Bankers bonuses are on the rise.

What relevance is that?

Dave101t wrote: »

its illegal to download it, its not illegal to watch it on a live stream, tho it is illegal for them to be hosting it.

Streaming is just another form of downloading though.

The clarity becomes a little muddy, but from what I understand if you download/stream copyrighted material in a way that the holder of the copyright has not permitted you to do so, it is a civil matter which the holder is entitled to take you to court to seek damages. However if you distribute in order to profit from that material then it becomes a criminal matter.

There are ramifications for the actions, but I think a lot of people are burying their head in the sand over the severity of what actually could happen, though there is almost safety in numbers because it is impractical and expensive to pursue individuals. Just depends how your moral compass is aligned though I guess, some can appreciate something for it's value while others just snatch all they can.

Halcyonman

Dave101t wrote: »

its illegal to download it, its not illegal to watch it on a live stream, tho it is illegal for them to be hosting it.

...and this is the crux of the matter. If you downloaded copyrighted material via P2P on to your hard drive then the MPAA, et al will come after you as you are a soft target. They are not going to come after Google, for example, for hosting it as they have more lawyers and money than them. It's simply the law of the corporate jungle kids.

Watching streamed content is a legal grey area. For someone who is doing a Multimedia degree, I am well versed in copyright law. I would expect the sword to fall on the hosting company for hosting the pirate material and providing you with unlicensed access (much the same way if you got a DVD for home use only and setup your own paying Cinema).

However with the rate of consolidation in the Industry, you probably find the Youtube, etc and the Films distributors are all part of the same corporation!

roddydogs

Do people really watch full length movies, without the continual "Buffering" etc, tell me how! yes i have got fast BB.

sporedude

roddydogs wrote: »

Do people really watch full length movies, without the continual "Buffering" etc, tell me how! yes i have got fast BB.

Streaming can be annoying, Better off getting a torrent.

And I dont feel guilty either about downloading.

Marty_J

sporedude wrote: »

Streaming can be annoying, Better off getting a torrent.

And I dont feel guilty either about downloading.

If you value it so lowly you're unwilling to pay for it, why go out of your way to steal it?

It seems odd to covet something you consider worthless.

roddydogs

Sorry for the "Silly" question, but what is a "Torrent"

Marty_J

roddydogs wrote: »

Sorry for the "Silly" question, but what is a "Torrent"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BitTorrent_(protocol)

Soubrette

anewhope wrote: »

Streaming is just another form of downloading though.

Downloading, file sharing or streaming in itself is not illegal - having or taking a copy of something is the illegal bit in this country.

It is extremely grey whether the bits of a film/music that you have watched on a stream and are in a temporary cache in an inaccessible part of your computer would actually be a copy under any legal definition.

Likewise it is extremly grey as to whether copying small parts of a film which are then stored in a temporary cache in an inaccessible part of your computer could be called copying a film/music under any legal definition. To expand on that, people are allowed to use small parts of copyright things such as songs/articles or books in their own work, it's called fair usage. Whilst I'm not saying that watching a stream constitutes fair usage I am saying that the law already acknowledges that a certain amount of something has to be copied to breach copyright.

The moral issue is a different argument altogether and really should be taken to The Arms or Discussion Time.

Sou

Marty_J

Soubrette wrote: »

It is extremely grey whether the bits of a film/music that you have watched on a stream and are in a temporary cache in an inaccessible part of your computer would actually be a copy under any legal definition.

Things stored in caches aren't considered to be infringing if they're technically necessary. For instance, you can't look at a copyrighted website in a browser without making a copy of it. So making a copy of it for the purpose of looking at it is OK (otherwise, no one would be able to see it).

Regardless, I don't think the length of time something exists on your HDD makes a difference. Even if you download a whole film and watch it immediately, it only has to be on your HDD for 90 minutes (or however long the film is) before you can delete it. I think we'd both agree that it would still be an infringement of copyright, despite being on your HDD for a very short space of time.

Whilst I'm not saying that watching a stream constitutes fair usage I am saying that the law already acknowledges that a certain amount of something has to be copied to breach copyright.

Yes, but "fair dealing" (as it's called in UK law) only applies in specific circumstances.

If you're streaming a film, you're making a copy of the whole film, transient though it may be.

Soubrette

Marty_J wrote: »

If you're streaming a film, you're making a copy of the whole film, transient though it may be.

It is dubious as to whether you have a copy of the whole film at any one time in your cache and it is to all intents and purposes inaccessible, that and the fact that it is automatically overwritten all, I feel, makes it hard to apply any meaningful definition of the word copy to it.

Fair use is also known as fair dealing amongst other things
http://www.copyrightservice.co.uk/copyright/p09_fair_use

I can't add anything else to this thread unless someone can come up with something better than I think, I believe, it seems to me, I feel it's morally wrong etc (and that includes myself). I have made it clear what makes it a grey area for me and included some links which seem to back up my viewpoint that it is not cut and dried illegal. Unless someone can come up with some concrete cases or quotes showing how watching a stream is definitely illegal then I'm afraid I shall continue to think it as a grey area and on my research so far is imo probably not illegal....yet.

Sou