long term sick and terminating my employment....help/advice needed

angela_2107

Hi all, i havent posted for a while as i havent been able to due to my illness but i am looking for some guidance really

I will make my post as brief but detailed as i can. I must point out i am not 'after anything' from my company just advice as to the best next step

I have worked for my employer many years, say 10 or so. I have been off from work on mat leave from oct 2008- march 2009. I was due to go back from mat leave in June 2009 but my doc signed me off sick with a pre existing condition that was agrivated by post pregnancy.

I have been 'on the sick' now almost 7 months, My GP and consultant simply cant tell me, or my employer when i will be returning. Work have been ok-ish about it up to recently. But obviously now are looking at 'how best to manage my illness' which where i work means get you back to work or get you out - i can see their point easily

I have had 3 home visits and they requested a doc report in may/June that said they expected recovery in 4-8 weeks. This didnt happen due to me not reacting well to the initial treatment so they put me on a less aggressive drug - which in turn takes longer to work.My employer has requested another doc report and i went to view it last week prior to them sending to my employer.It basically says i am doing all i can to get better,and i am being treated by 2 consultants and regular trips to GP. He also states i now have many adaptions after seeing OH worker. But he doesnt know when, if at all i will be fit to return to work. There are no other roles that i could do in the company either.

My question is..what do i do now?

Should i hand my notice in as it says recovery could be 12 months away, if at all - all depends on how my treatment goes.

I dont want my team mates to continue carrying my workload when they are already over stretched but i need to do the best for me.

It has been mentioned by HR that they may reach a 'compromise agreement' what does this mean?

Also, from a finance point of view i have many questions....

As i have been on mat leave and off sick i have lots of holidays too, i have 3 days from last year and i have accrued 15 days so far this year, taking into account mat leave and whilst i have been off sick. I get SSP but still accrue hols as per my contract. Would they have to pay me these 18 days holiday at my normal pay rate, or not? Just trying to get finannces sorted.

Also as i have to give a months notice how does this work? It states in my contract that i can be released and paid for the month - would this month be at my usual rate or ssp? oe would it not count as i am off ill

I do not wish to be seen to be fleecing my employer one bit - but then again i do not want to be selling myself short

And, my contract also states if i leave within 9 months of coming back of mat leave i must re-pay all my mat pay minus SMP...this IS the reason i havent handed my notice in so far - i cant afford to give them back 6 months mat pay...would they hold me to this if i am only handing my notice in due to the fact i really cannot see when i would be returning AND I am trying to do what is best for all involved ie me and them

Thanks in advance

For all those of you that are thinking 'you have taken them for all you can get' please dont post. I have just had this reaction in another forum. I can honestly say that is not the case. My employer is the best there is and was even allowing me to do a degree that they would assist towards costs etc. i would never want to take my employer for a ride, or take money i am not entitled to. I just want to know the answers to my questions and ideas as to thE best next step

SomeBozo

I would not resign, especially if they are mentioning possible compromise agreements. The compromise agreement is a legally binding agreement between you and the employer that ends your employment. You give up such rights as taking them to a tibunal, in return you would get a your notice period paid, sometimes more, plus you can ask for other things, such as a reference.

Your reason for leaving would be "compromise agreement" which is better than "resigned due to ill health".

As i have been on mat leave and off sick i have lots of holidays too, i have 3 days from last year and i have accrued 15 days so far this year, taking into account mat leave and whilst i have been off sick. I get SSP but still accrue hols as per my contract. Would they have to pay me these 18 days holiday at my normal pay rate, or not?

Technically yes, but I would try and have this included in the compromise agreement.

Bozo

Uncertain

You are on properly certified sick leave because you are unwell. There is no reason at all why you should not have everything you are entitled to.

Generally it is best not to resign for a whole number of reasons including your entitlement to benefits etc.

A compromise agreement may be the best way forward. This means that you and your employer agree to part company and they pay you a sum of money in compensation for the loss of your job. You in turn agree to give up any rights you may have to make any further claim against them for example at an employment tribunal. By law you have to receive legal advice before signing such an agreement and the solicitor has to certify that this has happened. It is normal for the employer to pay for (or at least towards) the legal costs.

Having been in a similar position myself I know how difficult this can be.

layanna_jade

Hi

I've worked in management and dealt with cases of long term sick many times. I would advise against resigning as, as you say, they would expect the repayment of the 6 months maternity leave. This was your right to receive this as part of your contract and you weren't to know that you were going to get ill.

You sound as if you are doing everything you possibly can to improve your illness by keeping in contact with the HR dept, regular visits to the GP, consultants and the company OH, etc. so keep up what you are doing and keep the lines of communication open.

If you were to leave of your own accord, then in addition to your month's notice, you would receive payment for any holiday accrued. However, this would probably be cancelled out by the repayment for the maternity leave.

Most employers will start to discuss termination of contract on the grounds of ill health at around the 11-12 month mark if you have been off continously for that time. If the decision to terminate your contract is made on this basis, then you would not have to repay the maternity leave, they would have to pay you for your contracted notice period (which I should imagine is longer than a month if you have worked there for 10 years) and any holiday accrued in the current holiday year.

I hope this helps you.

angela_2107

Thanks everyone for the qucik and helpful replies. I feel so torn. We have always been understaffed and over worked - as many places are. And i have been there when we have had to 'carry the can' for ppl off ill and its a hard slog to say the least. I do feel that it is a cloud hanging over me on a daily basis, i almost feel a cheat for being off taking sick pay and knowing i will probably never return...

Would it be frowned upon if when i next speak to HR (we speak most fridays)if i actually asked what my options are..or is that giving out the wrong signals? As much as i love my job i know the likelyhood of me returning dwindles every week

Uncertain

It is not your fault you are ill but you must put your own interests first.

I was told that an employer would normally try to avoid being the first to mention a compromise agreement as it could possibly be used in a claim for constructive dismissal. Given that they have mentioned it there is no harm in discussing the matter further. Mark anything you put in writing (inc emails) Without Prejudice.

Have the firm asked your permission to ask your doctor for a report? Discuss this with your doctor. You have a legal right to see any report before it is sent.

Do you have any access to free legal advice (e.g house or car insurance) trade union or professional association membership? Failing this talk to ACAS.

angela_2107

yes, the last 2 home visits they have done with me i have signed to state they can contact GP or specialist to get a report - personally i think the specialist would be a better option and told them so but they went to GP. I actually requested they did the 1st as i didnt feel i could explain my condition fully in words to them, even tho it was obvious to them what my condition is like at the minute i wanted them to have the full picture from a professional

I have been trying ACAS but they are so busy at the moment i cant even get through to queue to speak with someone! i will keep trying tho.

Just to add i think work are quite scared i will go down the Disability Discrimination route. I have never implied this, nor am i the kind of person who would rock the boat without reason, but they were in the porocess of a hearing when i went off on mat leave - i do believe they acted appropriately but the ex employee didnt see it that way.

I am friendly with someone who works in HR (not at my company) who has implied that they will be cautious as potentially i am covered by disability and maternity law. My condition was made worse as a direct result of pregnancy you see. With what i have learnt today from here that makes the compromise agreement more attractive to them doesnt it, surely? lol. Talk about confused!

SomeBozo

think work are quite scared i will go down the Disability Discrimination route.

I can't see why. Being covered under the DDA means that they have to adapt your work area and structure your work to your condition. As far as I can see you have not been back to work yet for them to even try to help you. Plus you say Occy Health has already made adaptions, you have had home visits, and from what I can see they have been a model employer and no need to worry about about any accusations.

I do believe they acted appropriately but the ex employee didnt see it that way

Don't listen to the "ex-employee". Look after your own affairs. You already state that :

My employer is the best there is

so don't listen to anyone else. Get help, get advice, but not from a "ex-employee".

who has implied that they will be cautious as potentially i am covered by disability and maternity law

I really would stop listening to duff advice. You are covered by employment law, the law and your contract.

From what I have read the employer has done nothing wrong and you are happy with things as they stand, yet you are still flirting with ideas that "they have done something wrong" and you are covered by "x.y and z".

Why?

Bozo

angela_2107

sorry Bozo, i think i didnt make myself clear.

what i am trying to say is that as my employer has been burnt in the past i think this is why they mentioned (almost in passing) the comp agreement.

Again, i stated that' I do believe they acted appropriately but the ex employee didnt see it that way ' meaning my employer, not the ex employees. If i thought my employer was not trust worthy i would of been out years ago. I believe my employer will always strive to meet the needs of all parties concerned.

What does concern me is that it is general practice that they will stand by you for 6-9 months then its in or out type situation. Again, this time frame is generous and i am thankful i have had their support for so long. I am just trying to find the best way forward for me, and them

I thank everyone that has taken the time to reply

Uncertian posted that employers usually shy away from being the 1st to mention these, but it would mean if i accepted it then i would not be able to take them to tribuneral - whcih i wouldnt anyway. i am glad for the support they have shown so far - i know i am very lucky.

We have spoken re things they can do to adapt my role but i am field based and cover 800 miles a week and cant drive so i cant do that. i am based from home so theya re looking at alternative roles but havent come up with anything as of yet.

Uncertain

The couple of times I have spoke to ACAS I have phoned a few seconds after 8.00am and got straight through as I'm told it can be difficult later in the day.

The reason for the worry about disability discrimination is that the firm could leave themselves open to unlimited damages if they were held to have discriminated..

I think you do need to get some professional advice. Most solicitors will see you for the first meeting for a fixed fee (£75 to £100). If you don't have access to free legal advice this could be money well spent. If spending one week's money on legal fees get you a month's extra.......

angela_2107

thanks, i am still trying ACAS and i have just pulled out my home insurance to see if i have help there, i am pretty sure they do some kind of employment helpline

Thanks again, this has really helped me - by typing down my thoughts and situation it somehow seems a little clearer now