Is there any point at which earning more money will lower your benefits by the same?

leveller2911

This is exactly why we should have a system where you are entitled to "benefits" for a certain number of years in your life, after you have used your allocation of years ,then your on your own.
There is no incentive for people to "better " themselves.

Anyone who goes through their working life not needing some form of help from the state is very fortunate, so we need the benefit system, at the same time we need a way of "making" people stand on their own feet...

QUESTION:What would happen if we all said "I think I'm only gonna work 3 days a week and claim benefits for the rest"?.........

ANSWER: The country would crumble............

spikeysoul

Interesting - what about all the sick/disabled people who are either unable to work (would be in the support category of ESA) or who are currently on tax credits (a form of benefit really) working 3 days a week becasue it's recognised they can't do full time work - and this keeps them above/just around the poverty line?

tpsaver

But is this really the case? Is it possible that my parents will lose as much in benefits as they make through extra work, or are they just under-informed?

LizzieS_2

Depends what they claim

Above certain income levels they will lose at the following rates:
39p for each £1 tax credits
20P for each £1 by paying income tax
11p for each £1 by paying NI

There is also a sliding scale for council tax and housing benefit.

There could be a single point where they are no better off, but there will be many more hours which will give them more income.

leveller2911

spikeysoul wrote: »

Interesting - what about all the sick/disabled people who are either unable to work (would be in the support category of ESA) or who are currently on tax credits (a form of benefit really) working 3 days a week becasue it's recognised they can't do full time work - and this keeps them above/just around the poverty line?

If people are "genuinely" disabled they should receive benefit.Tax credits are an entirely different situation.
The tax credit system has one major fault(too many small faults to name),this being the way in which it enables employers to pay the minimum wage and no more whilst knowing that the tax payers of the country will stump up the difference.As stated by the OP people are NOT encouraged to "better themselves" because they see no benefit from doing so.
We as a nation have far more people on the sick than any other nation in Europe,why? my view is its too easy to get on the "gravy train".When you consider we are a rich and advanced nation compared to most of the world why do we have so many sick people? Health and safety regulation are the most restrictive on the planet so its not down to industrial injuries etc.
If you look at my previous post I did mention we are all very lucky if we go through our lives without the need to claim some sort of benefit.

Vicky123

I don't think taking tax credits away would mean employers raising their wages, if it were that simple then everyone would agree.
Tax credits do supplement poverty wages.
Greed exists among all sections of society but it does seem as though the have's would much prefer the have nots to have even less.
The biggest disincentive to work is poverty wages not generous benefits imo.
Vicky

littlemermaid_2

Also recent press about the instability of available work - if you can get it! There aren't as many permanent jobs, just short term/agency/insecure work... So it's been argued better to stay on benefits and know when the money's coming in rather than going on poverty minimum wage that could stop any minute...

leveller2911

Vicky123 wrote: »

I don't think taking tax credits away would mean employers raising their wages, if it were that simple then everyone would agree.
Tax credits do supplement poverty wages.
Greed exists among all sections of society but it does seem as though the have's would much prefer the have nots to have even less.
The biggest disincentive to work is poverty wages not generous benefits imo.
Vicky

I agree partly Vicky, the problem is there is "benefit cycle" and most people can't/don't try and move off of it.As we are now in recession which will last for another year or so and after that little or no growth something has to give with the benefit system as tax revenues are falling through the floor.
I'm all for training etc to help people progress and better themselves but they are few and far between, more money should be cut from the benefit system and used to create proper training for people and not just government lipservice.

"The biggest disincentive to work is povery wages,not generous benefits"
Not sure I agree with that, human nature will more often than not take the easy way out so generous benefits will always win out the argument imo...

We have had 1,000,000 people out of work for the last 12 years, we have had a boom time and tbh there was no excuse for that.I had an uncle with MS and I,m proud that we as a nation gave him the help he needed,but I would also say he had far too much in benefits, he literally stashed cash around the house to keep his savings below the threshold,clearly wrong.
We need to make those who can train or work do so.

Sorry to OP for moving slightly off topic:D

leveller2911

littlemermaid wrote: »

Also recent press about the instability of available work - if you can get it! There aren't as many permanent jobs, just short term/agency/insecure work... So it's been argued better to stay on benefits and know when the money's coming in rather than going on poverty minimum wage that could stop any minute...

But like you said Littlemaid "recent press about ......" doesn't excuse the last 12 years or so.If we all do 3 days a week and claim WFTC for the rest where is the tax revenues coming from to pay them??.There is also a moral question too, why should people who work,many earning just above the wftc threshold subsidise the lazy ones(not the genuine sick).I knew a chap, disabled all his life,lost both legs but he bettered himself and worked hard.

Vicky123

I think initially benefits may be seen as a nice easy option but if we are really honest only the very dull and ignorant would find a life of watching Jeremy Kyle fulfilling. One thing that dreadful programme on benefits showed ,was as the claimants got older most of them wanted to work and start living rather than just existing.
I have only ever had a couple of very short periods of unemployment in my life and I found it utterly sould destroying and not the picnic it is often portrayed as.
This is also a bad time to try and reduce unemployment in any case but even in good times the minimum wage needs to be set much higher, there is no point in comparing the UK to third world Countries, we don't pay third world prices for anything here.
I do agree something has to be done about our benefit culture but it does have to be something real and not one mickey mouse scheme after another.
Vicky