Name on house deeds

amy.ackles

The house has three floors, two living rooms, three bedrooms, one bathroom and one WC.

In the letter my dad recieved, it asked him to sign the letter and send it back, which he did not do.

The solicitor checked the land registry and said that it is still in joint tenancy.
She instructed us to write a letter to the solicitor stating that we wanted to keep it as a joint tenancy.

Should we go and see another solicitor?

Amy

mwahaha

Hopefully someone more qualified can post but:

Was it sent registered post so he had to sign for it at the door, and when did he receive it? Was the signature on the letter actually to agree to severing the tenancy, or just acknowledge receipt? I'm not a solicitor but this was our (edited) advice:

'We need any acknowledgement ... we simply have to wait the required amount of time to allow for the post to be delivered and then a few more days to make sure the notices do not come back to this firm marked as "undelivered". It would be at this point that notices could be sent to the Land Registry'

Which agrees with the link in my previous post. So it seems that they haven't completed severing the tenancy yet as far as the Land Registry goes, but they don't need your Dad's agreement to do so.

amy.ackles

It was sent registered post and my mom signed for it at the door and we received the letter on 3rd August 2009.

"Was the signature on the letter actually to agree to severing the tenancy, or just acknowledge receipt?"

This is what we were not sure about which is why we went to see a solicitor.

The letter states:

"We act on behalf of you mother in connection with her affairs to which she has expressed a wish to sever the joint tenancy in the property (address stated) held in both names.

We enclose a Notice of Severance in duplicate for your attention.

Please would you sign the copy Notice in acknowledgement receipt where indicated and return it to me."

The document enclosed had been signed by grandmother and there was a space for my dad’s signature.

Amy

Essex_Maid

I cann't give any advice sadly. But, does your Dad have "legal assistance" on his own house insurance policy - if so this may give you free legal advice under this policy.

There is also Community Legal Service tel:
call 0845 345 4 345 www.communitylegaladvice.org.uk.

Richard_Webster

The person serving the notice of severance has to prove that the other person actually received it. Normally this is by getting them to say that this is the case. The father could deny he ever had it and it would be for the other party to prove he had. Writing letters saying "I never signed for it" is a good way of acknowledging you had it! Frankly in that case they would simply make sure the next notice got through - perhaps by giving it to him personally so they could swear an affidavit to that effect.

amy.ackles

So should we send the letter to their solicitor stating that we want to keep it as a joint tenancy, as advised by our solicitor?

Stewd18

Hi Amy,

Having read this thread and the poor advice you have so far been provided by your solicitor I felt the need as a long time lurker on MSE to register and post some advice for you.

The fact that your Grandma's solicitor has sent your Dad the notice is sufficient notice of her wish to sever the joint tenancy. To sever a joint tenancy you need only act in a manner which demonstrates that you see the property as shares rather than held 'jointly'. Now that the notice has been served I would expect that your Grandma's solicitor will apply to the Land Registry to put a restriction on the title deeds which essentially notes that the property is held as 'tenants in common' rather than joint tenants. The crucial part of this for your purposes is that this will mean that the right of survivorship no longer exists. I.e. when your Grandma dies the property will pass via her wish in her will rather than automatically to your Dad. How the exact share is determined will be a complex matter of fact although the presumption is that the property will be held 50/50. Evidence will be required to rebut this presumption.

I hope this helps and I suggest you visit a different solicitor!

SD18

mwahaha

Yeah, I agree with Stewd18.

You're going to have to accept that it's not a joint tenancy anymore, or won't be shortly. This doesn't mean it's 50/50, but it may be difficult to argue much different from that since it was your Gran's right to buy, and it sounds like she's been paying the bills.

And agree you should see another solicitor, at least for a free initial session. You need to establish what's likely to happen if your Gran does pass away. I believe that there's discretion about forcing a sale of a house if your Dad needs his share, so it may be better to agree what's going to happen sooner rather than later.

BTW you can check if it's been changed to Tenants in Common yourself by downloading the title register from the land registry for 4 pounds. If it contains something like:

No disposition by a sole proprietor of the land (not being a trust corporation) under which capital money arises is to be registered except under an order of the Registrar or the Court

then it's been changed to tenants in common.

Richard_Webster

So should we send the letter to their solicitor stating that we want to keep it as a joint tenancy, as advised by our solicitor?

The person serving the notice of severance has to prove that the other person actually received it. Normally this is by getting them to say that this is the case. The father could deny he ever had it and it would be for the other party to prove he had. Writing letters saying "I never signed for it" is a good way of acknowledging you had it! Frankly in that case they would simply make sure the next notice got through - perhaps by giving it to him personally so they could swear an affidavit to that effect.

So isn't a bit late for that? If she has served the notice then unless the Land Registry won't accept she has done so a tenancy in common has already been created so writing letters saying what you want is neither here nor there. Given that you have already remonstrated with her and she doesn't seem to want to change her mind, I can't see how such a letter is going to get her to change her mind. Unless you can prove that there was an agreement that the proeprty would be left to you when it was originally bought I can't see what you can do. She can do what she likes with her half share.

Stewd18

So isn't a bit late for that? If she has served the notice then unless the Land Registry won't accept she has done so a tenancy in common has already been created so writing letters saying what you want is neither here nor there. Given that you have already remonstrated with her and she doesn't seem to want to change her mind, I can't see how such a letter is going to get her to change her mind. Unless you can prove that there was an agreement that the proeprty would be left to you when it was originally bought I can't see what you can do. She can do what she likes with her half share.

Richard is correct. It is too late for the reply and in any case will have no effect. Your Grandma has severed the joint tenancy, you Dad does not need to accept her severance. It happens automatically as a point of law.

Yeah, I agree with Stewd18.

You're going to have to accept that it's not a joint tenancy anymore, or won't be shortly. This doesn't mean it's 50/50, but it may be difficult to argue much different from that since it was your Gran's right to buy, and it sounds like she's been paying the bills.


BTW you can check if it's been changed to Tenants in Common yourself by downloading the title register from the Land Registry for 4 pounds. If it contains something like:

No disposition by a sole proprietor of the land (not being a trust corporation) under which capital money arises is to be registered except under an order of the Registrar or the Court

then it's been changed to tenants in common

Mwahaha is also correct that there will be wording similar to the above if your Grandma's solicitor has registered the change at the Land Registry and the property is registered there. This change is likely to take at least a couple of weeks though.

Check with your soilcitor if your property is actually registered at the Land Registry. Depending upon when the property was first bought, if it was before 1991, then it may not be registered at the Land Registry as complusory registration was not necessary until then.