Unenforceability & Template Letters

Goodtimesahead

Quo Vadis, I would go via Credit reference agencies by disputing the data and telling them to investigate it with the lender, as its an old Goldfish account, its quite likely (as I've heard from some others already) that Barclays who took over Goldfish, took over a right !!!!!!! mess, so they may well come back saying they cannot find the data in which case you tell the Credit Reference agencies to ask them to remove the data if they can't find it, as they would be reporting unlawful & incorrect data and therefore the CRA's are also posting unlawful data. Tell them it must be removed forthwith otherwise you will report them all to the appropriate legal reglatory authorities!
You should get a result whereby the lender agrees to remove the onerous data.. Good luck! Let us know how you get along.

never-in-doubt

Quo_Vadis wrote: »

Hi Everyone, I originally put this post on the Credit Card charges forum but this thread may be more appropriate - especially in light of some of the advice that's been passed.

I submitted an SAR to Goldfish and today, over two months and three letters later, I received a reply from Barclaycard (who now operate Goldfish). They cannot find the statements or any other account information between June 2007 and the date the account was sent to a DCA (1st Credit - don't you just love them?) in August 2008 - a total of 14 months.

Anyone any idea where I now stand? The total of (alleged) debt that was passed to 1st Credit was £10k. Is the debt enforceable?

I have obviously sent a letter back to Barclaycard asking them to confirm thay have no records and an email to 1st Credit ensuring they have none. Strangely I had another Goldfish account (formerly Morgan Stanley) and statements were present up until the time it was passed to a DCA (Cabot) in September 2008.

Any advice gratefully received!

It doesn't matter that they cannot find statements for the period you request - this has nothing to do with unenforceability - its more about correcting data.

Unenforceability only occurs if there are discrepancies on the CCA - if you send the very first letter (+£1) then check it with the prescribed terms you'll know whether it is enforceable. Have you been send a copy, with your SAR?

Just cos some statements are missing does not affect enforceability - this would be reported to the FOS and you can obviously argue any charges etc but that's it.

The CRA's will not remove anything, nor are they obliged to do so. Only if it is clear libel will they take any action, in that you have confirmation from the OC that they cannot provide a CCA - only then will they consider removing anything. Otherwise its a waste of time.

never-in-doubt

Goodtimesahead wrote: »

Quo Vadis, I would go via Credit reference agencies by disputing the data and telling them to investigate it with the lender, as its an old Goldfish account, its quite likely (as I've heard from some others already) that Barclays who took over Goldfish, took over a right !!!!!!! mess, so they may well come back saying they cannot find the data in which case you tell the Credit Reference agencies to ask them to remove the data if they can't find it, as they would be reporting unlawful & incorrect data and therefore the CRA's are also posting unlawful data. Tell them it must be removed forthwith otherwise you will report them all to the appropriate legal reglatory authorities!
You should get a result whereby the lender agrees to remove the onerous data.. Good luck! Let us know how you get along.

Mate you're getting slightly confused here - remember the rules work per account and cannot be generalised. What may work for you, will not necessarily work for others so you may see me type a letter for XYZ using the example you quote - but as my last post suggests, i'd only do that in such case where no CCA or default notice has been provided.

It would not work this way just for lost statements within a SAR. Therefore going to the CRA's not only shown you don't know what you're doing but that they will simply ignore you by responding saying sorry, go to the OC and ask them!

soot1975

Hi Never In Doubt.

I have 3 creditors totalling £22,000 debt.

I'm thinking of using the unenforceablity letters you proved but I have a few questions.

1/ During the time periods and stages of these letters do you stop making payment contributions to the creditors?

2/ What creditors usually have the largest problems with 'unenforceability'???

3/ What happens if we fail? Do we get more charges and late penalties?

4/ I'm trying to buy more time with my creditors as I'm not working right now. How much time would this buy?

Thank you for your help.

James

jojo1964

Does anybody know of any companies whom people have had success against, just wondering if certain companies are more prone to making mistakes than others

Quo_Vadis_2

never-in-doubt wrote: »

Mate you're getting slightly confused here - remember the rules work per account and cannot be generalised. What may work for you, will not necessarily work for others so you may see me type a letter for XYZ using the example you quote - but as my last post suggests, i'd only do that in such case where no CCA or default notice has been provided.

It would not work this way just for lost statements within a SAR. Therefore going to the CRA's not only shown you don't know what you're doing but that they will simply ignore you by responding saying sorry, go to the OC and ask them!

Hi N-I-D, Thanks for the advice ..... I am VERY new to the checking CCA lark - I only found the statement discrepancy because of charges I was trying to claim back. I have written to 1st Credit re one account - they have replied to nothing so far - letters, four emails, etc - VERY unlike them and Cabot's have sent me a very nice letter saying they haven't got a CCA but are sure there is one with the OC and they are sure they will get a copy to me in 12 days - we'll see!!!

I'll let you know how it progresses!

Thanks again,

QV

never-in-doubt

jojo1964 wrote: »

Does anybody know of any companies whom people have had success against, just wondering if certain companies are more prone to making mistakes than others

Nope, its not about companies - more about the time you took credit. You need to get the CCA and then compare against prescribed terms in the first instance. Only then will you know because they will either send it, send a blank one or say they cannot find it.

Different scenarios then take place dependant upon what response you get, if any. :eek:

never-in-doubt

Quo_Vadis wrote: »

Hi N-I-D, Thanks for the advice ..... I am VERY new to the checking CCA lark - I only found the statement discrepancy because of charges I was trying to claim back. I have written to 1st Credit re one account - they have replied to nothing so far - letters, four emails, etc - VERY unlike them and Cabot's have sent me a very nice letter saying they haven't got a CCA but are sure there is one with the OC and they are sure they will get a copy to me in 12 days - we'll see!!!

I'll let you know how it progresses!

Thanks again,

QV

Hiya

Stick to the format outlined in this thread and you will not go wrong. If they do not send it or claim they have lost it move on to the next letter in line and when all else fails and they simply refuse to remove the default then come back and we'll sort it for you.

Good place to see template letters i've done for people is on the sutton default removal thread and how to get back onto the credit ladder thread. Worth having a mooch...

Good Luck.

never-in-doubt

soot1975 wrote: »

I'm thinking of using the unenforceablity letters you proved but I have a few questions.

1/ During the time periods and stages of these letters do you stop making payment contributions to the creditors?

It is up to you, if you place the account into dispute then you can, but usually you cease to repay if they do not send the CCA or if they do not send it in time (12 + 2 days). Personally, if they have already defaulted you then i'd always suggest ceasing payment because this gives you bargaining tool to repay in exchange for default but usually only works if you repay in one lump sum not monthly repayments which for £22k i'd assume is the case.

2/ What creditors usually have the largest problems with 'unenforceability'???

All of them! They all fight it, naturally, they don't want to lose money like you and I don't want to, however if you do things right and they have made mistakes then there is little they can do - they have to accept the law.

Remember this only applies to accounts taken before 2007.

3/ What happens if we fail? Do we get more charges and late penalties?

They will always add charges etc regardless of whether you ask for the CCA which is, all you're really doing. There is nothing to fail. You simply write and send £1 asking for a copy of the agreement, then depends what they say in response depends what you do next as per page one of this thread explains.

4/ I'm trying to buy more time with my creditors as I'm not working right now. How much time would this buy?

If you're not working then i'd suggest you speak to a councelling service and do not pay anything to anyone. Have a read of the link below (Dealing with Bailiffs) to confirm any worries that they cannot make you bankrupt or come into your home. This may come in use.

If you are unemployed then do not pay creditors - obviosuly if you're not defaulted then ignore this advice and speak to CCCS or CAB asap! Ceasing payments only applies to defaulted accounts as your credit file is already knackered - if you're in an arrangement with no default then its best to try and work round this.

Dealing with Bailiffs

Good luck.

soot1975

Thank you NEVER IN DOUBT for your fast answering.

Actually my story is an unusual one.

I'm a UK Citizen now living in Prague Czech Republic. I have a Mortgaged Property in the UK and I'm scared of losing it or it having charge(s) placed on it. I'm not so concerned about my UK Credit Rating as I won't be living in the UK again (or for many years). But I really don't want to lose my house. I just want to keep the wolves away from the door until the house prices have recovered and I can put it up for sale....(1.5 - 2 years).

My debt is £22,000 with 3 lenders:

1/ Cahoot - £3,800 unsecured loan (older than 2007) - missed payments for almost 6 months and about to go into default

2/ Alliance & Leicester - £10,000 unsecured loan (newer than 2007) - 4 missed or reduced payments

3/ Barclaycard - £7,500 Credit Card (older than 2007) - no missed payments, just minimum payments

I have spoken yesterday to "Payplan" and I'm thinking of this option of paying 350-400 a month forever ;-( until debt has disappeared.

But after I sell the house in the UK I'm not sure what to do......walk away from the UK debt. What powers to UK creditors have with with European Debt Collection.....?

My simple question is how can I best solve this problem before they take the legal route and arrange CCJ's again me...????

Thanks

James...