is this legal -maybe constructive dismissal

mum_of_4

not sure if this is the right place but here goes

My OH is in a decent position with managers under him and then their staff. The comany have made some cut backs already (its' a big company) and made changes it its structure. My OH role was ok although he raised concerens with those above and had it confirmed that his role wouldn't change. My OH has a good salary and is on a years notice contract

Now he finds that his managers are in no doubt that they see other managers if they have problems within their departments and these said managers have also met with the lower staff members and changed the work they are doing even when the staff have said the my OH has asked them to do something else.

MY OH line manager has not emailed him for several days even though my OH has asked him too, avoiding telephone contact as well.

My Oh has got his job discription but it's very wolly but has very detailed objectives set at his appraisals and reviews.

No one has said to my OH that his role was changing but clearly it has even his staff have said that they are now working for someone else. My OH is highly respected by staff and other senior managers and even one senior manager (although not on his line of command) as shown concern in how my OH is feeling.

So my question is what can he do? I've told him to copy emails to our home PC that may help a contructive dismissal case, just in case it comes to that.

Apologies if this isn't the right place for posting

SomeBozo

Sorry, what have they done again? Some people who worked for him are working for someone else now? And the role change is actually a "you can approach any manager" situation?

I can't see any evidence of CD. Can you elaborate?

Bozo

mum_of_4

SomeBozo wrote: »

Sorry, what have they done again? Some people who worked for him are working for someone else now? And the role change is actually a "you can approach any manager" situation?

I can't see any evidence of CD. Can you elaborate?

Bozo

Well not sure it is classed as CD

Basically he has found that he now has nothing to do. His managers now report to someone else and their staff. He can't see what he's got to do anymore.

I've just spoken to him and he's said 'they've made the role redundant without going through the proper process'

He hasn't even been told by his manager what's going on. He's left lots of emails and spoke to his PA twice. He was also told to expect a call from another senior manger ( a person that laughed when my OH pointed out that they weren't paying enough notice to the staff that had been layed off as they should of been getting another 4 weeks pay, and said that in life there were more loses than winners) within 2hours but that was 4 hours ago. His bosses, boss is on holiday but he may phone him Sunday evening.

BlueIsTheColour

I dont really understand either? I guess until he gets some definite info from the company its hard to advise.

Post again when they have been in touch. The trouble with lots of companies is that they just do what they are going to do regardless of whether it may be right or wrong, but until they actually do something, its hard to say....

Zazen999

Is there anything in writing that these other managers can show to prove that they have been told to report to a different manager?

staffie1

Doesn't make much sense. What does you OH's boss say? What do HR say?

p00hsticks

mum_of_4 wrote: »

Now he finds that his managers are in no doubt that they see other managers if they have problems within their departments and these said managers have also met with the lower staff members and changed the work they are doing even when the staff have said the my OH has asked them to do something else.

I don't want to sound picky, but in order to get some sensible responses people need to fully understand the situation. Perhaps I'm being thick, but your paragraph above makes no sense whatsoever to me. I understand that you may be upset /wound up about this but can you please review what you've written and re-phrase what you wanted to say so that it's a bit more understandable for people, and then we'll be in a position to advise.

CFC

Yep, I'm afraid I dont understand the problem from what you've posted.

sandford6016

In my opinion, and it's how I view my business, if the people he line manages are going around him to higher managers to get things done, your OH is not doing his job properly! I'm sure this isn't the only matter, but I would certainly be wondering why I am employing someone that staff can easily by pass to get their own way, and he cannot get a grip of them to stop it!

ceridwen

So - to paraphrase _ I guess what you are saying is:

"My O.H. has a high-level managerial position. He has recently found that all the staff he manages have been told that they are now being managed by different people (but no-one has actually told HIM this). As a result of this - he has literally nothing to do all day at work now."

"He has asked higher management what is happening - and has had no response at all to date."

This is how I am interpreting your initial post - have I got this correct?

If I am correct in my interpretation - then I guess the clue as to what is happening is:
- the 1 year notice period your O.H. is due to have if they make him redundant
- the presumably hefty redundancy payout he is due for if they make him redundant.

If I interpret your post correctly - then I guess what is happening is that the company has decided that your O.H. is redundant - but doesnt wish to tell him so (as it would cost them this year's notice + large payout) and they are hoping he will get fed up with "kicking his heels all day" and save them the money by just resigning.

As far as I know - I believe the legal position is that no-one is actually legally entitled to demand that their employer gives them work to do. As long as the employer gives them the salary/etc they are due to give them - then the company has fulfilled their legal obligations and doesnt actually have to give them any work to do. I may be wrong on this - and will doubtless be corrected if one of the solicitors that read this Board know different. But that is my understanding for what its worth of the law
- which would boil down, if correct, to it would be a seriously bad idea for your O.H. to try resigning and claiming "constructive dismissal" - as he would probably lose.

Either way - best for your O.H. to give written letter to whoever is in overall charge asking him to "clarify the situation" as to what tasks he is now required to do.

Either way - I would strongly advise AGAINST your O.H. resigning - with or without a constructive dismissal claim lobbed in (I bet thats exactly what his employer wants him to do - ie a bad idea from OH's point of view).

Grovester_2

ceridwen wrote: »

As far as I know - I believe the legal position is that no-one is actually legally entitled to demand that their employer gives them work to do. As long as the employer gives them the salary/etc they are due to give them - then the company has fulfilled their legal obligations and doesnt actually have to give them any work to do. I may be wrong on this - and will doubtless be corrected if one of the solicitors that read this Board know different. But that is my understanding for what its worth of the law
- which would boil down, if correct, to it would be a seriously bad idea for your O.H. to try resigning and claiming "constructive dismissal" - as he would probably lose.

Either way - best for your O.H. to give written letter to whoever is in overall charge asking him to "clarify the situation" as to what tasks he is now required to do.

Either way - I would strongly advise AGAINST your O.H. resigning - with or without a constructive dismissal claim lobbed in (I bet thats exactly what his employer wants him to do - ie a bad idea from OH's point of view).

I'm not so sure.

If your role was 'to manage 10 people' and the company decieded that those 10 people are now managed elsewhere then your role is changing significantly. Some people enjoy leading a team, and now in this case they are no longer able to do that. Additionally that person could find themselves missing out on training etc. as it's now not relevant to their postion, others in the business may resent this person for not having work to do when everyone else is either busy or at risk of redundancy, this all leads towards being forced out.

It's not about being busy it's about being able to do the job you were employed to do and if my understanding of what's happened is correct then the OP cannot do the job they were employed to do and this could in the future restrisct them in their career.

All in my opinion of course