Date on parking ticket

RenegMC

Hello,

Just wondering, the parking ticket was issued on the 26/7/09 and we've been told on the ticket we have 14 days to pay it from the date of the contravention.

I quote
"A penalty charge of 100GBP is now payable and unless this PCN is challenged, must be paid not later than 22/08/2009"

and...

"The penalty charge will be reduced by a discount of 50% to 50GBP if it is paid not later than 08/08/2009"

Anyone care to reaffirm my thoughts that the 8th Aug from the 26th only provides 13 days? Granted 9th is a Sunday, but would this count as a administrative error on the councils part? Would this ticket therefore be invalid??

Thanks kindly!!!

Meepster

26th, 27th, 28th, 29th, 30th, 31st, 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th 7th & 8th...

That adds up to 14 days doesn't it?

RenegMC

Well, 14 days should be sunday to sunday to sunday no?

26th at 3pm, to 27th 3pm = 1 day,
to 28th 3pm = 2 days,
to 29th 3pm = 3days
to 30th 3pm = 4 days,
to 31st 3pm = 5 days,
to 1st 3pm = 6 days,
to 2nd 3pm = 7 days,
to the 3rd 3pm = 8 days,
to 4th 3pm = 9 days,
to 5th 3pm = 10 days,
to 6th 3pm = 11 days,
to 7th 3pm = 12 days,
to 8th 3pm through to midnight = 13 days...

So the 14th day should fall on the Sunday again...


EDIT: didn't include in the opening post that ticket issued at 3pm on sunday 26th.... But same logic would apply for any given time from 00:00 on the 26th onwards...

Also, extrapolating that further to the 22nd also presents the same problem... providing 27 days rather than the 28 stated on the PCN.

Meepster

No, it doesn't work like that; the 8th is day one, up to 12:00 midnight (regardless of what time the ticket was issued) and then begins day two. It gives you 14 days to pay, starting from the day of issue, NOT 336 hours. Sunday to Sunday would be 15 days...

RenegMC

Thank you muchly for the replies.

Not to argue, but any links to official council definitions of 1 day?

Seems as though the council divided the day into 24 hours by introduction of a 24hour payment service... so I guess unless it is officially defined in legislation as such...?

I just hate how pedantic these enforcement committees are, so my aim is to be equally pedantic in countering them and their unjust 50 quid fine, to a 64 year old man (my dad).

Meepster

Well a day can only really be defined in one of the following ways:

The period of light between dawn and nightfall; the interval from sunrise to sunset.
The 24-hour period during which the earth completes one rotation on its axis.
One of the numbered 24-hour periods into which a week, month, or year is divided.
The portion of a 24-hour period that is devoted to work, school, or business.

They are the official definitions of a day.

And you are right, each day IS divided into 24 hours, or 1440 hours or 86,400 seconds. Each DAY starts at 00:00:00 and ends at 23:59:59. That is a DAY. You are talking about 24 hour periods, which, although they can be a day (if started at 00:00:00) are not exclusively a day (if started at any other time)

And as for the ticket: What was it for? Have you asked anyone to look at it to see if it is valid?

Coblcris

Council definitions are irrelevant, I am relieved to say.

Counting dates has come under judicial scrutiny often.
In relation to notices concerning contraventions the Barnet case is often referenced.

'From' and 'within' are different.

sarahg1969

OP - it would be useful to post up all of the ticket, so that someone can scrutinise it for errors and advise.

The wording must be absolutely precise, although I have to say the wording you've mentioned looks unusual, and I wonder if this ticket has been issued under different legislation? We'll need to see it to comment properly.

RenegMC

http:// yfrog.com /2j79146503jx

Two spaces after http:// and before the second /

Two pics of the parking situ, and one for the parking ticket.

Also, heres the appeal I wrote using the appeal template on this awesome website:

[FONT=&quot]Dear Sir or Madam,[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Parking ticket number: [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Vehicle registration number:[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]I received a parking ticket on 26th July 2009, but I believe there are mitigating circumstances to explain why I had parked where I did and I would like to submit an appeal for the following reasons: [/FONT]

·[FONT=&quot]Mitigating circumstances [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]There are mitigating circumstances to explain why I parked where I did so I am requesting that the fine be waived for this reason. [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Please see attached evidence, as proof of my appeal.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]The main reason I parked as I did, was because I was unloading a heavy item, for collection and repair by a serviceman in residence; please refer to the Receipt of Goods Notice and Invoice detailing the dates and times of the repair work carried out. I have never driven my car down this dead end road before, as I have had no reason to, and as a result could not have been aware of the unsigned restrictions in place. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]As a man of 64, I have medical problems, including chronic shoulder injury, arthritis, a heart condition, and having undergone a heart bypass operation, I would not have been able to lift the heavy computer up onto the pavement, hence I temporarily parked there, to make not only the unloading slightly easier, but also to avoid injury or excessive strain.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]In the event that someone had required use of the pavement, I ensured there was enough room on the pavement for a wheelchair user, pedestrian, or a mother with pram to pass by. This can be seen in photo 1 on page 1. This is also on the assumption someone might have required use at some point, whilst I did definitely require use.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Photo 1 on page 1 of the accompanying photographs shows also another one of the reasons for parking the way I did, as it shows that clearly, had I parked fully on the road, I would have blocked access to emergency services, whilst blocked access to a dead end road.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]In addition, I waited in the car for nearly 10 minutes to gauge the activity of the road, in terms of both pedestrians as well as cars; the street was completely inactive, with many other cars parked stationary. Immediately after I left my car, I received a fine. There was ample time for a parking attendant to make me aware of the contravention, but within 1 minute of my leaving the car, a fine was put in place.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The attendant also did not allow time to determine whether an unloading or loading was taking place. The ticket shows the attendant waited for less than 1 minute, and I arrived at 15:05 to find a ticket in place. I do not feel this is fair, as I took every precaution to ensure I parked appropriately.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Up until this point, I have never received a fine for this contravention, but now I am fully aware of it, I will make sure that in the future I do not park as such. As this is the case, and as it is my first contravention of this nature, I request that the fine be waivered.[/FONT]

• [FONT=&quot]There was insufficient signage[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]I was unable to determine what the relevant parking restrictions were because there was no clear signage to explain what they were. Please see attached evidence, as proof of my appeal.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]The only signs present are shown clearly on pages 1 and 2 of the accompanying photos, and they do not adequately represent the nature of the restrictions in place.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]The regulation regarding the contravention is inconsistent and unenforced in numerous areas, as is shown on pages 4, 5 and 6 of the accompanying photographs. These clearly show not only areas where there are multiple cars parked upon the pavement in a road significantly wider than that which I was parked on, but also where signs are present clearly indicating restricted areas, with numerous examples of cars in contravention of this.[/FONT]

·[FONT=&quot]Invalidity of the PCN[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]According to the [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Civil Enforcement of Parking Contraventions General Regulations (2007), the ticket should detail grounds under which I am able to appeal, but it has no details at all with regards to this.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]The ticket also states my car as being black, but as the pictures show, it is not black but blue.[/FONT]


[FONT=&quot]Finally, I believe that the fine is too much in monetary value, but is also rather harsh, due to the mitigating circumstances I have outlined above.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Attached to this letter is all the evidence I have collected with regards to this matter. I hope we can come to a fair and appropriate resolution.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Yours faithfully,[/FONT]

Thoughts? Cheers people My dads resigned to paying it, but if we do end up having to pay it, then I'm happy to waste their time going through the appeal... It's really poor what councils are up to - didn't even deny the cashcow nature of parking enforcement when we spoke to one of them over the phone.

sarahg1969

I can't see it as the image is blocked here at work, but hopefully someone else can help. It is ALL of the ticket, front and back, isn't it?

Meepster

Unsigned restriction? Of course it's unsigned. You can't park on a pavement and expect NOT to get a ticket if seen. It's in the highway code! Just think about the poor old dear in a wheelchair, who has to go on the road to get past THAT car and then gets run over by a bus. THAT's why you can't park there...