Distance Selling Regulations

Hintza

I am reading the other boards/threads about returning goods within 14 days for any reason if bought online.

How do we sellers stand on EBay?

VH

Not sure if EBay is covered by the regs. It's not a UK company, and it always seems to be able to get around the law in every other area. As it's an auction as well it would be in a very grey area.

Also by using EBay you agree to abide by their terms and conditions, one of which is that sellers don't have to have a returns policy. If you don't agree - don't buy.

The other major factor is whether you are a private seller or a trader. Distance selling regulations simply won't apply if for example, you bought something off someone who was clearing their loft out. The law simply doesn't apply to private sales in the same way.

I am a private seller and there is no way I would accept an item back because someone had changed their mind. Tough - don't buy it in the first place! If the item wasn't working however, or clearly not as described, I would offer a full refund, but only because I am nice!

System

Not sure if EBay is covered by the regs. It's not a UK company, and it always seems to be able to get around the law in every other area. As it's an auction as well it would be in a very grey area.

The distance selling regulations apply to the seller, not ebay.

Also by using EBay you agree to abide by their terms and conditions, one of which is that sellers don't have to have a returns policy. If you don't agree - don't buy.

Ebay's T&C cannot override the law, no matter what some sellers may think.

The other major factor is whether you are a private seller or a trader. Distance selling regulations simply won't apply if for example, you bought something off someone who was clearing their loft out. The law simply doesn't apply to private sales in the same way.

Correct, although some sellers may perceive themselves not to be a business, the law may take a different view. Clearing out your loft is most likely private, buying from a boot sale and re-selling on ebay is probably business
.

I am a private seller and there is no way I would accept an item back because someone had changed their mind. Tough - don't buy it in the first place!

Fair enough, neither would I.

If the item wasn't working however, or clearly not as described, I would offer a full refund, but only because I am nice!

Unless the item was described as faulty, it would be a breach of contract not to refund the buyer all their costs, even though you are a private seller.

There are too many sellers on ebay who think that they can put some nonsense in their T&C, such as not accepting responsibility if it is lost in the post, and that this overrides the law.

VH

Did a bit of checking on Government and Trading Standards websites:

Quote from Office of Fair Trading Government website regarding Distance Selling Regulations:

The regulations do not apply to:

financial services
sale of land or buildings
purchases from a vending machine or automated commercial premises
the use of a public pay phone
auctions, including internet auctions
rental agreements that have to be in writing (i.e. a lease for three years or more)

Relevant page can be found here.
One note though - a German court ruled not long ago that EBay is not an auction house ??? ??? ??? (then what is it please) so that their version of the distance selling regulations apply.
However no such ruling has been made in the UK so I guess what's on the Goverment website is correct, you can't get better clarification than from the Office of Fair Trading.

Hope this clarifies things.

System

Hope this clarifies things.

Not really as you are assuming that they are talking abut ebay when they refer to internet auctions.

If ebay were an auction then I am sure that the authorities would have more to say, as ebay does not comply with the laws relating to auctions in the UK.

VH

I wasn't assuming that they were talking specifically about EBay, there are plenty of other internet auctions out there.

But I would have thought that if you put an item up on on EBay for 'auction', and then buyers 'bid' for it, then you sell it for the highest price, then what else could it possibly be classed as if not an auction?

I really don't understand how you can possibly classify the above as anything else but an auction. Unless you are German of course. ;D

I admit that I am no legal expert but it seems clear to me.

System

With a 'real' auction:
- is there an end time even if bidding hasn't finished?
- can you withdraw your bid if you change your mind?
- is the person who put in the previous highest bid now liable to buy
- can the seller withdraw an item whilst an auction is in progress
- can a seller set a fixed price (i.e. Buy it now)
- etc, etc

Does ebay comply with the Auctions (Bidding Agreements) Acts 1927 and 1969 and the Auctioneers Act 1845?

Although ebay has some appearance that it is an auction, it is in reality just a marketplace where sellers can advertise their goods.

VH

Precisely the point, it's not a 'real' auction, it's an internet auction, which is a different kettle of fish.

System

But your quote from the goverment website was:

"auctions, including internet auctions"

Since ebay is not an auction, it's not an internet auction.

VH

Think we'll have to agree to disagree on this one, PMM.

Merry Christmas all the same! ;D

Hintza, sorry for getting a little carried away on your thread!

Hintza

No problem VH.

But an interesting discussion!

All seems to hinge on the definition of an auction and as far as I can see that has yet to be challenged in the courts.

So I reckon we are probably safe for now, but it all might change in the future if too many folk get scammed.