Builder not finished job - but won't give keys back until he gets paid!

Prav

Thanks everyone, for the comments. You've all given me lots of reassurance, for which I'm very grateful. I wanted to press the thanks button on every post, but thought it maybe overkill!

Another development. Couldn't get to the locksmiths today. I arrived at the flat this evening to find the electricity not working. I couldn't see anything wrong with the fuse box, but am pretty sure he's let himself in and sabotaged the isolator which is in the communal area of the flat.

The problem is he has the keys to the main communal entrance, so I'd also have to get this changed - which looks like an expensive proposition. Just more hassle and I feel a bit uneasy that he's just let himself in. Bit like I've been burgled type thing.

Also contacted NICEIC and they say they should be able to send a duplicate certificate - but not sure if this development might mess things up.

Cknocker

Seriously contact the police explain the situation, while the bulk is a civil matter i would say he is now trying to extort money with menaces, which is a criminal matter.

MrYorke

get in the flat, buy new locks and let HIM take the matter up with a solicitor. I work in the construction trade and it really annoys me when contractors do things like this to customers.

Sit him down and have a chat before you decide anything else. Get both your points across and then make your decision. But i'd say, get in the flat as its your property at the end of the day and he cant stop you entering!

Alan_M_2

There's a lot of advice flying around here with very few facts.

Can we have a list of the work carried for the £1300 in detail (i.e how many radiators were painted? Were they removed, painted and refitted, or painted in place? How big are the radiators.

What other work was carried out for this sum (in detail)?

If the builder is project managing and responsible for the entire build why was he not supplying the kitchen? If you are responsible for supplying items then the builder is not in complete control of the project. Therefore he is not the project manager and not responsible for delays casued by you not supplying items.

Did the builders original quote/estimate itemise what he would be doing? If it did, can you post the content?

Many years ago I had a tiling and bathroom installation business, we would provide estimates to supply, fit and run the entire job. Often a customer would then do a little research and find they buy the suite and items at 10% - 20% less than I was supplying to them...this was our margin.

If the customer wanted to supply the suite and or fittings, we would proceed, but any delays caused by them not supplying on time would be charged at out day rate for us standing around twiddling thumbs........

If I supplied, they paid the 10%-20% premium but we swallowed any lost time. That's the way it works.

I'm reading between the lines of your post that you are supplying many of the items being fitted. If you don't supply the item in an agreed time, you are throwing out the builders schedule and costing him time (therefore money).

You have assumed some items were included in the original quote that clearly weren't. You have instructed the builder to complete these items with out discussing their cost as an extra, is this correct?

Oh, and lets stop the rubbish about police shall we, everyone seems to be conveniently forgetting that the OP voluntarily gave the keys to the builder to carry out the work....you'll struggle to prove any form of theft in these circumstances. It's civil and that's it.

The builder of course runs a risk that if the flat is burgled during the period which he holds keys that he will be held responsible....but then my neighbour holds a set for me for emergencies...they'd be asked the same question if my house were burgled.

The bottom line here is there isn't enough information being provided to come to a sensible conclusion. I'm actually thinking this whole situation is being casued by a lack of communication from both parties.

Cknocker

Alan, valid points, but these are the questions that I am trying to get the answers for: -

1. Were the extra works instructed?

If they weren't any payment is out of good will on the part of the client, if they were the builder doesmn't have a right to charge any thing he feels like, in a situation of lack of agreed rates I would revert to published rates.

2. Dayworks - A delay is only a delay if it is genuine, dayworks are to be agreed with the client in all circumstances, if you don't let the client know you are being delayed he can't do anything about it. The kitcen was late being delivered, did the builder have no other work to do? Not having a kitchen doens't stop you working in a bathroom, but you can incur additional costs if you have to say bring a plumber in twice as a result.

3. The plastering issue, plastering the wall and the reveals can be legitimately carried out as two seperate operations, I would consider a couple of hours daywork due to works being cqarried out of sequence maybe acceptable.

If the builder is entering the house an messing around with the electrics in order to make the client feel uncomfortable, that is a matter for the police.

I've worked on both sides of the coin, a number of years as a site manager on construction projects and now as a client PM, so I do try to balance what is right and wrong both morally as well as contractually - that is the big problem here a lack of contract.

Alan_M_2

Cknocker wrote: »

If the builder is entering the house an messing around with the electrics in order to make the client feel uncomfortable, that is a matter for the police.

Where is it suggested that the builder is entering the property and messing with the electrics in order to make the client feel uncomfortable?

The only mention of electrics I read is the builder rectifying (voluntarily) work not done to the required standard.

Simply a waste of police time and resources, this is clearly civil and any suggestion otherwise is nonsense.

Cknocker

This line: -

"Another development. Couldn't get to the locksmiths today. I arrived at the flat this evening to find the electricity not working. I couldn't see anything wrong with the fuse box, but am pretty sure he's let himself in and sabotaged the isolator which is in the communal area of the flat."

If he is indeed messing wih it I don't see that as being purely civil. If its civil you take it through the courts, not start playing.

Whether he is playing is of course something that has to be proven, but that is the polices job! Of course they will try to avoid getting involved.

As far as I'm concerned, the keys are still theft, look at it this way, If I loan you my car, and two weeks later ask for it back and you refuse, is that or is that not theft? Try it with a car hire company see what happens.

Alan_M_2

Cknocker wrote: »

This line: -

"Another development. Couldn't get to the locksmiths today. I arrived at the flat this evening to find the electricity not working. I couldn't see anything wrong with the fuse box, but am pretty sure he's let himself in and sabotaged the isolator which is in the communal area of the flat."

If he is indeed messing wih it I don't see that as being purely civil. If its civil you take it through the courts, not start playing.

Whether he is playing is of course something that has to be proven, but that is the polices job! Of course they will try to avoid getting involved.

As far as I'm concerned, the keys are still theft, look at it this way, If I loan you my car, and two weeks later ask for it back and you refuse, is that or is that not theft? Try it with a car hire company see what happens.

It's civil, as it was taken with consent. Not handing the item back is breach of contract not theft.

If you're still not sure, phone the police and see how far you get.