Paying for Care

dirtyflannel

People always moan because the home of an elderly person who needs to go into care has to be sold to pay for the care. This is usually due to family feeling robbed of any in heritance. Care costs money and has to be paid for. The best way to fund the elderly would be to pay an insurance scheme throughout your working life then homes wouldn't need to be sold. The trouble is today you get the workers who struggle to pay the shirkers who never or won't work to pay and the richer society. Resentment does build up when you work and struggle and non-workers are better off due to all the benefits they claim. Makes you wonder if it is worth bothering struggling to pay a mortgage only to have it taken one way or another.

margaretclare

Errata wrote: »

Link here http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2009/jul/14/older-people-care-home

The report is titled "A day in the life of an old persons home"

What struck me most forcibly was the comment that the residents all have a shower every week, as if that was some big deal - a great treat or something.

I don't think I could survive if I didn't have a shower every single day, first thing. In this hot sticky weather I often have another shower before bed, because I don't like the feel of sweat drying on my skin.

Errata

EdInvestor wrote: »

Looks like nobody is happy with these ideas.

http://www.citywire.co.uk/personal/-/blogs/money-blog/content.aspx?ID=349649&re=6202&ea=156896

No surprises there, then.

My MIL was in a care home with 14 residents and the staff ratio was about 1:1.

That's quite a risky ratio. 14 staff will be split over 24 hours between early, late and night shifts and rest days. That could mean only 3 staff on duty for 14 residents and as it can take 2 staff to move someone it only leaves 1 staff member for everything else whilst that's being done.

chcfan24

dirtyflannel wrote: »

The best way to fund the elderly would be to pay an insurance scheme throughout your working life then homes wouldn't need to be sold..

Both my husband and I have paid insurance from the age of 15 until retiring so did my father but during the two and a half years he was in care I paid almost £60,000 on his behalf for abusive care. I moved him twice into 3 star homes but he continued to be abused.

These proposals are to move responsibility for care from the NHS to Social Services, the Green Paper only mentions 'health care needs' not health needs.

monkeyspanner

Errata wrote: »

No surprises there, then.



That's quite a risky ratio. 14 staff will be split over 24 hours between early, late and night shifts and rest days. That could mean only 3 staff on duty for 14 residents and as it can take 2 staff to move someone it only leaves 1 staff member for everything else whilst that's being done.

Yes thats is possible but when my MIL was ill additional staff were provided to cover and the owner lived in a flat in the care home and either her or her daughter were always ether on duty or available if required.

Staff were always far more visible than in other care homes I have seen and did not retire to the kitchen to have a chat.

happyinflorida

All of this is my living nightmare at present. My father died 20 months ago. My mother has alzheimer's and had to go straight into a care home that social services had as an emergency until I could find a long term care home - the problems began as my parents had just made "enduring powers of attorney" (epa) - which gave a solicitor's full control of my mother's finance's and me - her only daughter - nothing! I'm not allowed access to her medical records - to prove she was incapable when she made her will and epa and social services initially sent all my mum's health assessments to the solicitor's, who refused to send them onto me for reasons of confidentiality!

I've battled since in trying to find a good care home - it's taken three changes and one manager of an EMI care home (elderly mentally impaired), even had her stopped from being moved as she accused me of financially abusing my mum as I was moving her to a cheaper home!! I had to have a long meeting with three people to discuss why I wanted to move her (I felt she was being abused and starved - but, hey, what did I know and what could I prove?!) - eventually it was agreed that although they all felt my mum was perfectly ok where she was, the relationship between myself and the manager had broken down too far, so permission was given to me to move her - they recommended somewhere and it's proved fantastic, so good came out of that - unbelievably!

It's all been a nightmare though - the solicitor's are insisting my mum's house be sold now - at the worse time to sell a house, so my future inheritance is going to be considerably less and we need it to pay off our mortgage, but I've accepted that may not now happen and to be honest, I'm glad as I don't want this to happen to my kids if either myself or my husband need a care home.

My mum's care homes have cost from £875 per week, for the emergency home provided by social services, £575 for the next one I found - then £650 for the nightmare one and now £560 for a nursing home - so much less.

The solicitor's have got through approx. £30K in fees in the last 20 months - that really annoys me as they refuse to do anything at all that I ask and won't give me any information at all - I would never, ever put things in the hands of sol's - they are the biggest rip off ever!

There's nothing I can do about it all though as the "Court of Protection" are very happy to have sol's running the show, rather than me as my parents set it all up to have them, so I cannot do anything but watch the money being drained away by everyone else! It is so frustrating.

chcfan24

Happyinflorida how frustrating for you, was your mum assessed before going into care. My dad died two years ago this month. My dad never thought about sorting out PoA and I must admit neither did I. It was only when he suffered sudden onset Vascular Dementia that I had to apply for an EPA through the Court of Protection. The solicitor charged £650 to arrange this which I now realise I could have done

My dad's first care home in Jan'05 was an EMI home but within 7 weeks all his belongings had been stolen. I moved him into a home highly recommended by Social Services, costing £2000 per month.

During 2006 I became aware of NHS CHC funding so I applied I wasn't successful due to my lack of knowledge on the subject and the manager of the home insisting in the MDT meeting that my dad was very predictable.

My dad was admitted to hospital with a suspected stroke but he was black and blue when they undressed him. While in hospital he was granted CHC funding as they said he was bed blocking I moved him into an EMI home, he died 10 days later.

I applied for a retrospective review of my dad's case with the PCT. While going through all his medical records, care home notes I noticed the manager had been giving him antipsychotics without prescription which is why he was always asleep and why as it states in his care notes he was falling into diabetic comas. I won funding they paid back all money I had paid plus interest.

I have included links for you to have a read and possibly discuss with the solicitor. I would have thought being as she needed EMI care she should at least qualify for RNCC payment which is about £125 per wk.

www.nhscare.info

http://www.dh.gov.uk/en/Consultations/Closedconsultations/DH_4139205

http://www.cheselden.co.uk/continuing_care/assessment_nf.htm

http://www.judy-waterlow.co.uk/

http://www.cheselden.co.uk/continuing_care/assessment_bnf.htm

Best wishes

nsdlil

Dear Forum ,
Why has this whole tax proposal not simply been regarded as a lower level imposition of death duty , it doesn't seem to be a novelty to me at all ?

whereforcare

how frustrating for you, was your mum assessed before going into care. My dad died two years ago this month. My dad never thought about sorting out and I must admit neither did I. It was only when he suffered sudden onset Vascular Dementia that I had to apply for an EPA through the Court of Protection. The solicitor charged £650 to arrange this which I now realise I could have done

My dad's first care home in Jan'05 was an EMI home but within 7 weeks all his belongings had been stolen. I moved him into a home highly recommended by Social Services, costing £2000 per month.

During 2006 I became aware of NHS CHC funding so I applied I wasn't successful due to my lack of knowledge on the subject and the manager of the home insisting in the MDT meeting that my dad was very predictable.

My dad was admitted to hospital with a suspected stroke but he was black and blue when they undressed him. While in hospital he was granted CHC funding as they said he was bed blocking I moved him into an EMI home, he died 10 days later.

I applied for a retrospective review of my dad's case with the PCT. While going through all his medical records, care home notes I noticed the manager had been giving him antipsychotics
without prescription which is why he was always asleep and why as it states in his care notes he was falling into diabetic comas. I won funding they paid back all money I had paid plus interest.

I have included links for you to have a read and possibly discuss with the solicitor. I would have thought being as she needed EMI care she should at least qualify for RNCC payment which is about £125 per wk.


Best wishes[/QUOTE]


I'm fairly shocked by a lot of these comments to be honest- prescribing anti-psychotics without a gp's consent and a prescription is an offence that is enough to get a nurse struck off.
Also very good to see that (unfortunately) unlike many people out there most of you are aware of your rights and the right to move your relatives to a home that does provide a much better standard of care than those you initially chose- very unfortunate that you and your relatives have to go through this experience in the first place though.
Having worked in many care homes and for companies over the past twenty years, as well as having 'mystery shopped' numerous homes, I can absolutely say that yes- there are some awful care homes out there, but equally, there are also some great ones with terrifically staff who make those care homes a place to live rather than a place to die. In my experience, regardless of whether a care home is run by a corporate company or a one-man band, it is the manager who will determine the level of care delivered- if they to you feel warm,caring and capable, then odds-on that is the culture they will pass on to their staff and from which their residents will benefit. if you don't feel comfortable with the care home manager- don't choose that home.

Errata

I'm fairly shocked by a lot of these comments to be honest- prescribing anti-psychotics without a gp's consent and a prescription is an offence that is enough to get a nurse struck off.

Actually, it's enough to put them in prison for administering a noxious substance. I wonder why it wasn't picked up?