Advice on Teeth Whitening Discussion Thread

welshdent

Tooth whitening has been classed as dentistry for a long time.

There are 2 issues that are at the crux of this.

1 is the point that these cowboys repeatedly bleat on and on and on about - that is, the concentration of peroxide being used. These characters pretend incorrectly that they dont use peroxide and thus are legal. Well thats not correct because the chemicals they DO use dissociate IN to peroxide hence the whitening effect on teeth.

BUT thats not the main issue.

The bit that makes them illegal is that they are carrying out dentistry. They can scream as much as they like that it is a cosmetic procedure. It isnt and they are at best mistaken or at worse, liars. Carrying out tooth whitening and the accompanying examination is dentistry. Thus, unless it is being done by a dentist directly or by a GDC registrant following an exam and treatment plan from a dentist then it is being done illegally.

Another of the arguments is that we as dentists are trying to rip people off, prevent others earning a living, dont want any competition etc etc etc. Blah blah blah. Its all complete nonsense. I do a few whitening cases a year at most. It is not what I consider a major component of my working life. I CAN tell you that I talk more people out of it that in. In fact I did that today. My point is, if I stopped tomorrow then it would have no real impact on my income. What I care about is that patients of mine and the public in general are not harmed and put at risk by unscrupulous individuals that lie for a quick buck leaving people damaged. If I were to never whiten someone again in exchange for these clowns never doing it then I would consider it a good trade off.

The public needs to be made aware of the risk they are putting themselves in for the sake of mistakenly saving a few quid here or there.
There are many other issues such as regulation, cross infection, indemnity (not this flawed concept of insurance that they claim to have) that come in to play but I do not have the time to go in to all that. Just believe what we say. We have nothing to gain from it, certainly not personally. In fact one could argue that we could gain from people coming to see us having damaged their teeth, burnt their mucosa or been left with fillings and crowns that have NOT changed colour despite assurances that they would .... be safe be legal and report these cowboys.

CLARE

Can sodium bicarbonate result in chemical burns... I didn't think so,but I had whitening of my gums following procedure which I have since learnt is chemical burns.
I also had white 'burn' marks to my hand and face. These were stinging and I was given a baby wipe which did stop the stinging and the marks vanished .
The lady that did the teeth whitening told me that she used super whitening sodium bicarbonate gel. Apparently it contained no peroxide and no sodium perborate .. but would it have caused burns without either of these ingredients?

System

CLARE wrote: »

Can sodium bicarbonate result in chemical burns... I didn't think so,but I had whitening of my gums following procedure which I have since learnt is chemical burns.
I also had white 'burn' marks to my hand and face. These were stinging and I was given a baby wipe which did stop the stinging and the marks vanished .
The lady that did the teeth whitening told me that she used super whitening sodium bicarbonate gel. Apparently it contained no peroxide and no sodium perborate .. but would it have caused burns without either of these ingredients?

would it depend on what it is mixed with? In itself bicarbonate of soda does not burn, but it fizzes if you mix it with an acid.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_bicarbonate

jugglebug

Sodium Bicarbonate is baking soda.
It is used in whitening toothpastes as an Abrasive.
I can't imagine how it could be used as a tooth whitening agent by itself
I think your lady is either telling fibs, or has been told fibs by their supplier.

Toothsmith

CLARE wrote: »

Can sodium bicarbonate result in chemical burns... I didn't think so,but I had whitening of my gums following procedure which I have since learnt is chemical burns.
I also had white 'burn' marks to my hand and face. These were stinging and I was given a baby wipe which did stop the stinging and the marks vanished .
The lady that did the teeth whitening told me that she used super whitening sodium bicarbonate gel. Apparently it contained no peroxide and no sodium perborate .. but would it have caused burns without either of these ingredients?

The problem is that her 'training' will have been a day at most of swallowing hook, line and sinker exactly what the people selling her the stuff were telling her.

That is often inaccurate at best, and downright lies at worst (like the 'fact' that its perfectly legal for them to be doing it!)

PLEASE report this to the GDC before someone is really damaged by her.

consumeradvice

Just to clarify. If people are using legal products no training or dental supervision is required as per EU and UK law. This has always been the case.

Regretfully, some non-dentists continue to use peroxides in excess of 0.1% and some dentists still use in excess of 6%which is also illegal. Both groups need to be stopped.

It is the GDC's opinion (not the law) that teeth whitening is dentistry, but this is conflict with the EU cosmetic regulation and a House of Lords ruling. Trading Standards allow non-dentists to trade due to these legal rulings.

Many providers do not touch the client at all and the process is completely hygienic and safe. The operator does not diagnose dental problems, the client visits their dentist to determine any oral health issues and the client confirms that they have no problems.

In the unlikely event there was a problem, the safe and legal ingredients will not irritate the gums or the harm the enamel. High street chemists are allowed to sell over the counter teeth whitening gels because their products hold Product Safety Certificates (PSA).

You can apply these products yourself or ask a friend to assist you. If a person is disabled or unable to clean their own teeth it would be ridiculous to say the helper was a criminal and performing dentistry because they were brushing someone's teeth with whitening toothpaste or sodium bicarbonate etc., not to mention passing on horrible infectious diseases.

Chemicals that release peroxide for example sodium perborate have to comply with the legislation too. The products with a PSA and currently on the market release 0.05% peroxide.

If you want to use a non-dentist services, a reputable one should be able to provide you with the ingredient list of their product and the PSA. You can also use good old word of mouth recommendation. Some dentists have admitted openly on the net (with full name and photo) that they are prepared to use illegal products and without labeling, so buyer beware.

Finally the reason some training is required to use the equipment is due to the insurance requirements. However, in reality no training is needed at all. Hairdressers do not have to train to operate legally either and they use strong peroxides. Two women using home dye kits have died due to an allergic reaction.

The slanging match that is going on across various sites is depressing and the general public seem to be unimpressed with dentists behaviour. You do not see or hear GP's doing the same about the many invasive beauty treatments, which can spread diseases, scar people etc. Wrongly or rightly the public begin to believe that the argument comes down to money. Many people complain about the cost of dental treatment or avoid being treated due to the cost for example; a friend of mine is in pain and needs a filling the NHS dentist quoted her £105, I advised her it should have been £48. She still decided she could not proceed.

The other concern is efficacy, once again you can seek recommendations. Many non-dentist provide a money back guarantee. I have never seen this on a dentist site before.

All of the above can be verified if necessary. I hope this information provides a balanced view of the teeth whitening debate.

brook2jack

II'm afraid the above poster is wrong.

The gdc is a statutory body which has legal powers to protect the public. These legal powers have been used to prosecute both individual beaiticians and companies which practice tooth whitening for illegal practice of dentistry. For details look at the gdc site. (Unfortunately on phone so will post links later.) However illegal whiteners often quote the house of lords ruling wrongly and the recent prosecution of a devon cosmetologist the magistrate dismissed the optident defence as not applicable.
Beauticians organisations such as babtac and habia have warned beauticians not to whiten teeth and talked of hundreds of claims against beauticians for damage caused by illegal whitening and indeed a quick search through this site alone will reveal many people harmed by whitening.

Most beautician organisations will not offer insurance for whitening as there is no nationally recognised qualification for beauticians in tooth whitening.

If you read beauticians forums there are countless stories of people paying thousands of pounds for courses and equipment only to find their insurances are useless pieces of paper and what they are doing is illegal.

Finally there are people who have been permanently damage by illegal whitening from having asthma made permanently worse to having teeth and gums permanently damaged. Anyone wanting dental whitening needs to have their general and oral health checked by a professional before having a chemical strong enough to change the colour of the strongest bit of your body placed inside one of the most sensitive parts of your body. That is the law and common sense.

brook2jack

This link from the nhs explains the legality well and is a neutral source http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/dentalhealth/Pages/teeth-whitening.aspx

Toothsmith

'Consumeradvice' is obviously not Consumer Advice, but Industry Stooge.

The reason the illegal whitening industry is getting in such a tizzy at the moment is that now, at last, there really is some pressure being brought to bear on the regulators (Trading standards and the GDC) to actually get off their backsides and enforce the law.

This means that even the 'big boys' (and girls) with their TOWIE, X factor and other minor celeb endorsements are beginning to get squeezed and investigated.

Mega White got a stand at an upcoming dental trade show to try and push it's 'legal' whitening product, but were forced out due to professional uproar when the organisers realised that they also run illegal salons.

They are also having their stands booted out of wedding shows up and down the country as the organisers of the shows are becoming aware of the law on such matters.

Whitening group 'Pearlys' have had their 'at home' whitening kits kicked off the shelves of Boots, and their clinics are under close scrutiny. (It needs members of the public treated by them to be prepared to give evidence though)

The group set up to put pressure on the illegal whiteners are beginning to get media interest from programs like 'Watchdog' and other consumer television and radio programs.

The illegal whiteners have had their day.

consumeradvice

If you check all the cases prosecuted by the GDC, non of them were for people using legal products. The beauticians case was struck out and the GDC has not gone back to court with this particular case.

In all the other cases unsafe products were used, there was harm to the public or risk to public health. One person was purporting to be a dentist and advsertising he was using dental nurses when he was not.

I have taken advice from a barrister on this and have raised a concern with EU. The dentists are actively lobbying to stop teeth whitening being carried out by a non-dentists, but this can never happen for the reasons outlined above. You cannot prosecute someone for using a legal product e.g. whitening toothpaste on another person, your friend, child etc.

There is no reason for people to spend thousands of pounds on teeth whitening training and equipment. If these business people had carried out due diligence they would have saved themselves a lot of money.

You are right, you cannot obtain insurance for illegal products, but you can gain certification in using a manufacturers equipment and supplies. This is the same for all beauty training.

I realise there is a lot of conflicting information out there and even some Trading Standards are unclear in some authorities, but common sense tells you it does not make sense. Trading standards in our are are very clear.

However, people can break the law if the give dental advice or use illegal products. To be on the safe side some operators do not even touch the client so they cannot possibly be practicing dentistry.

I hope this makes sense and is helpful.