Having problems getting endowment funds back

itm2

I recently requested the surrender of an endowment policy that I hold with Phoenix, but am having problems recovering my money.

They originally received my surrender request on March 5th. After a couple of weeks I got a letter saying that my signature did not look the same as the one on the original agreement (it did to me), so I had to send them a copy of my passport.

A week or so later I phoned them to see what was going on. They said they never received my passport copy, so I faxed it to them. I then got an email on April 1st (which I had requested), confirming receipt of my fax, and saying: "...we have all the required documents required. Policies are normally paid out within 7-10 working days of from when we receive all required documents but this should be done quicker.".

Yesterday was the 10th working day so I phoned them, and could not get through. The funds are still not in my account.

What rights do I have to demand my money back???

dunstonh

What rights do I have to demand my money back???

You will get the money but they also have a responsbility to make sure the money goes to the right person. If your signature differs it can create problems if the money isnt going to the lender. Also, they now have to comply with money laundering rules on maturities and old plans often never had any checks on them at the start so they have to do them on maturity. This typically means doing an electronic money laundering check. For most that is fine but for significant minority failure of that is not uncommon (living in a flat, not on electoral roll, no telephone number, house is named rather than number can all reduce chances of success). If you want the money paid to a different account to that of the direct debit or by cheque can also create delays.

Usually its an idea to get these things sorted in the 3 months before maturity. However, not all insurance companies are that quick. Especially the closed ones like Phoenix.

If the insurer is not satisfied that the money belongs to you then you can demand all you like and they are quite right to refuse to pay it until they are satisfied. You really need to speak with them about it though because that is the only way you will get an answer. However, remember that the 10 days is an estimate for them to do the work and once they have done it, it will take another 3 working days to hit your bank account. Or even upto 7 more days if you used a building society or ex building society as the receiving account.

itm2

Thanks for your reply. I understand the need for care from their perspective, but given that they know my home address and my bank account details, how much risk can there be in sending a cheque to my home address or transferring the funds straight back to the bank account that has been debited for payments into this policy for the last 15 years?
I just really wanted to know how I can stop them dragging their heels for another 3-4 weeks on this, as I feel a right of access to my own money - particularly having already waited 6 weeks.

Newly_retired

Similar story for me, but in the end we did get it , plus interest for the delay period.

dunstonh

how much risk can there be in sending a cheque to my home address

Unfortunatly, fraud is more common with cheques than using the clearing system. Also, knowing the bank details it is going into helps the criteria of money laundering verification.

or transferring the funds straight back to the bank account that has been debited for payments into this policy for the last 15 years?

That makes things a lot easier and you usually find it saves a few extra checks.

just really wanted to know how I can stop them dragging their heels for another 3-4 weeks on this

They shouldnt do. It shouldnt really take any more than their normal servicing levels. They should also add interest to the maturity value given the length of time.

alcee12

can anyone help me i had a endowment with royal sun alliance taken out in 1999 and i stopped paying into it in 2001 due to financial problems ,i wrote to pheonix who took over from rsa but they said it had no value as i only made 19 payments which were £60 a month i wrote again but they are not budging is there anyway i can claim this back please help

dunstonh

alcee12 wrote: »

can anyone help me i had a endowment with royal sun alliance taken out in 1999 and i stopped paying into it in 2001 due to financial problems ,i wrote to pheonix who took over from rsa but they said it had no value as i only made 19 payments which were £60 a month i wrote again but they are not budging is there anyway i can claim this back please help

You stopped paying before it obtained a value. So, there is no value to return. Typically values started to appear between the 18th and 24th premium depending on provider.

These old plans had the charges front loaded (as they were priced for use in a boom/bust, high inflation economy and took the charges in the early years, unlike modern plans which are effectively pay as you go).

alcee12

dunstonh wrote: »

You stopped paying before it obtained a value. So, there is no value to return. Typically values started to appear between the 18th and 24th premium depending on provider.

These old plans had the charges front loaded (as they were priced for use in a boom/bust, high inflation economy and took the charges in the early years, unlike modern plans which are effectively pay as you go).

hi dunston if there is no value to the policy how will i no if the policy was misold and maybe i can go down that route, ta

dunstonh

alcee12 wrote: »

hi dunston if there is no value to the policy how will i no if the policy was misold and maybe i can go down that route, ta

If you bought the product without advice (i.e. via an advert) then you cant complain as no advice was given and you were not sold it. You bought it. If you bought it through an adviser then you put the complaint to the advising firm as it was recommended to you.

However, the fact that there were charges in the early years and you stopped it and didnt get any money is not grounds for complaint. That was the structure of the plan and had been the structure of those for decades. It would have been documented. The typical risk warning of that era was that you will get back less than you paid in or possibly even nothing if you stopped paying in the early years.

If you used an IFA, you could possibly have a good case for bad advice as ISAs an and unit trusts would have been available for £20pm back then. If you used a tied agent, then probably not as they often got round the ISA/UT problem by setting their minimum premiums on those at £100pm but keeping their endowments/MIPs at £20pm minimum. Tied agents only have to sell you the best product in their own range that matches you needs. Not the best product overall.

alcee12

dunstonh wrote: »

If you bought the product without advice (i.e. via an advert) then you cant complain as no advice was given and you were not sold it. You bought it. If you bought it through an adviser then you put the complaint to the advising firm as it was recommended to you.

However, the fact that there were charges in the early years and you stopped it and didnt get any money is not grounds for complaint. That was the structure of the plan and had been the structure of those for decades. It would have been documented. The typical risk warning of that era was that you will get back less than you paid in or possibly even nothing if you stopped paying in the early years.

If you used an IFA, you could possibly have a good case for bad advice as ISAs an and unit trusts would have been available for £20pm back then. If you used a tied agent, then probably not as they often got round the ISA/UT problem by setting their minimum premiums on those at £100pm but keeping their endowments/MIPs at £20pm minimum. Tied agents only have to sell you the best product in their own range that matches you needs. Not the best product overall.

it was definately an independant advisor but is well retired now do i get back in touch with the company who it was through and mention this ,ta

dunstonh

alcee12 wrote: »

it was definately an independant advisor but is well retired now do i get back in touch with the company who it was through and mention this ,ta

The product provider has no liability as they gave no advice for the sale. The advising company has the liability. If the company is still trading you put the complaint to them. If they are no longer trading then you can put the complaint to the FSCS.