[Student] Moving out before the agreement over

bigheadxx

samsong_1234 wrote: »

Thanks Martha

Your positivity helped me to seek out some advice, despite all the "cant be done" posts it turns out there are two legal documents i can use to get out of an agreement early.

I can Surrender Tennancy, as long as the landlord agrees (so basiclly what you said martha by just asking them).

The second is called a deed of assignment which will also work aslong as i find a replacement to take my place in the house (again roughly what you had said martha).

But you CANT actually do anything without either the landlords consent or by finding a replacement tenant. If students cant work out these basic things themselves then why the hell are they at university?

Martha66

theartfullodger wrote: »

Humbly suggest you read what was signed at the beginning of the tenancy, in particular if any guarantors were provided... Because if they were the LL will simple get the money owed from them.

In my experience student lets are usually only granted if someone else guarantees the rent as students have been know to disappear...

If it's mum, dad, granny or your best-mate's dad - think before acting!

Good luck!

Artful
(LL with a student house..)

Absolutely right - if you have a guarantor and leave without landlord/lady's permission, then yes, they would be entitled to go after the guarantor for remaining rent due.
But, if OP is able to reach an agreement with a, hopefully reasonable, landlord/lady, that he can find a replacement (obviously someone respectable/acceptable to the landlord/lady), than the tenancy would be officially re-assigned to the new tenant and neither OP nor any guarantor would be liable.
Hopefully OP has a reasonable landlord/lady who wouldn't want to force someone to live somewhere/pay rent when they could easily get in a willing replacement to pay the rent.

samsong_1234

bigheadxx wrote: »

But you CANT actually do anything without either the landlords consent or by finding a replacement tenant. If students cant work out these basic things themselves then why the hell are they at university?

Exactly :rolleyes:.

If you read any other post than Martha’s, you will discover no one even mentioned these two factoids, thus why i thanked Martha because her post led me to my conclusion that it could indeed be possible.

Why did you even bother adding a worthless internet troll comment in here pointing out something which was already established, and then having a pathetic swipe at me personally calling into question both my intelligence and my existence at a university?

bigheadxx

samsong_1234 wrote: »

Exactly :rolleyes:.

If you read any other post than Martha’s, you will discover no one even mentioned these two factoids, thus why i thanked Martha because her post led me to my conclusion that it could indeed be possible.

Why did you even bother adding a worthless internet troll comment in here pointing out something which was already established, and then having a pathetic swipe at me personally calling into question both my intelligence and my existence at a university?

I have read all the posts but Marthas doesnt establish anything new. If you have the Landlords consent then anything is possible, you can paint the house pink with the landlords consent.

You have entered into a contract until the end of August and there are very few landlords who are going to want the trouble of a 3 month let when you have already committed to paying the rent for that period.

Its basic business your LL wants the most money for the least work.

samsong_1234

bigheadxx wrote: »

I have read all the posts but Marthas doesnt establish anything new.

Martha was the only person to suggest the following two things:

1. Why don't you in the first instance just ask your landlord/lady if you could leave early?
2. The landlord/lady should have no problem finding replacements

No one else even suggested these two things. With some pursuit on my own to several people both within the university and outside organisations, I came to my own legal conclusions via Martha’s suggestions.

Without Martha’s post, I would not have even pursued those lines of enquiry due to the posts that proceeded as they all suggested I would have to stay for the full 12 month term.


So to conclude for anyone browsing this in a similar position, the answer is yes you can get out of it by using either of these with the consent of the landlord:

1/ Surrender Tenancy
2/ Deed of Assignment Tenancy

:T

tbs624

Martha66 wrote: »

You do have a chance (no guarantee but worth a try) of getting out early.

Why don't you in the first instance just ask your landlord/lady if you could leave early? They may be more reasonable than you think, especially if you offer to find/help find a replacement (i.e. place an advert, etc).

Maybe things have changed since I was a student in London (there were lots of student lets for 9 month leases), but that was over 10 years ago.
London has alot of transient people looking for short/ish lets, especially over summer, including summer course foreign students, postgrads, etc. So the landlord/lady should have no problem finding replacements (unless the place is a complete dump, and even then, sadly with costly "budge", i.e. affordable to low incomes/students, it would probably get occupied!).

If your landlord/lady refuses to allow to break the lease, you could still risk leaving early. You'd have to be brave and risk things going to court: The landlord/lady does have a responsibility in law to show they have made reasonable efforts to find a replacement tenant. And it shouldn't take 3 months.
But do speak to a legal adviser (Shelter's helpline would be a good start) before risking this.
To start with, your university must have a student housing/advice centre. Do go there.

The OP is seeking to renege on a contract, and needs to understand that even if the LL did agree to him/her being replaced by another tenant then s/he would be expected to cover the LLs reasonable costs involved in finding that other tenant. The new T has to be acceptable to the LL, and the OP would be reponsible for paying the rent in full until any new T moved in. If the LL could only find a T willing to pay a lower rent then the OP could be expected to make up the shortfall for the balance of the original contract. A recent case, albeit for a commercial tenancy, suggests that a LL does not necessarily have to mitigate their loss.

There is no Council Tax to pay on properties that are let only to students, hence they are let for a full 12 months because otherwise a summer holiday CTax liability would rest with the LL. Your suggestion of 2 or 3 month short lets is fine in principle but the main problem is that a LL cannot legally repossess before *6* months is up, so if a summer T decided to stay on beyond their original couple of months the LL would miss the opportunity to relet in late Sept/Oct for the following academic year.

It is not just private LLs who charge rent for periods when students are not in residence:some Universities have halls for which the tenancy agreements extend well beyond the academic terms.

As a young adult, the OP needs to understand what Fixed Term means and for you to suggest that s/he runs the risk of leaving early is poor advice: s/he could end up with a CCJ and a lack of LL reference for her next tenancy.

Martha66

bigheadxx wrote: »

I have read all the posts but Marthas doesnt establish anything new. If you have the Landlords consent then anything is possible, you can paint the house pink with the landlords consent.

You have entered into a contract until the end of August and there are very few landlords who are going to want the trouble of a 3 month let when you have already committed to paying the rent for that period.

Its basic business your LL wants the most money for the least work.

I disagree. I hope there are still a reasonable number of decent landlords out there who would not want to trap someone in an unwanted lease when there are perfectedly acceptable replacements out there. Admittedly it may not be as easy finding replacements in different areas, but London does have alot of extra people staying just for the Summer. Many of these are students, perhaps foreign students doing a summer language course, perhaps foreign or UK students doing a summer course or perhaps doing a summer internship. And of course there are alot of postgrads, some of whom lived in Halls during term-time and now want a summer residence to complete their dissertations.

I also don't see where the "trouble" is. At most a basic credit check, which, especially if avoiding agents and their fees, doesn't cost much. And a simple signing of a re-assignment document. Easy to find templates online, and the OP can find these and print them out to save the landlord half an hour's web searching.
The OP can also do all the leg-work involved in finding a replacement - advertising, showing them the house.

Obviously the landlord doesn't have to agree but hopefully OP's landlord is a reasonable person with a sense of decency.

Martha66

tbs624 wrote: »

The OP is seeking to renege on a contract, and needs to understand that even if the LL did agree to him/her being replaced by another tenant then s/he would be expected to cover the LLs reasonable costs involved in finding that other tenant. The new T has to be acceptable to the LL, and the OP would be reponsible for paying the rent in full until any new T moved in. If the LL could only find a T willing to pay a lower rent then the OP could be expected to make up the shortfall for the balance of the original contract. A recent case, albeit for a commercial tenancy, suggests that a LL does not necessarily have to mitigate their loss.

There is no Council Tax to pay on properties that are let only to students, hence they are let for a full 12 months because otherwise a summer holiday CTax liability would rest with the LL. Your suggestion of 2 or 3 month short lets is fine in principle but the main problem is that a LL cannot legally repossess before *6* months is up, so if a summer T decided to stay on beyond their original couple of months the LL would miss the opportunity to relet in late Sept/Oct for the following academic year.

It is not just private LLs who charge rent for periods when students are not in residence:some Universities have halls for which the tenancy agreements extend well beyond the academic terms.

As a young adult, the OP needs to understand what Fixed Term means and for you to suggest that s/he runs the risk of leaving early is poor advice: s/he could end up with a CCJ and a lack of LL reference for her next tenancy.

Not ending up with a CCJ and lack of reference is precisely why I recommended OP approach their landlord and try to agree a solution (hopefully easily achievable if a reasonable landlord).
|f the OP advertises himself and shows the house himself, the costs would be low - a credit check does not cost much. And all documents such as tenancy agreements and deed of assignments are available free as templates to download and print out (so perhaps 50p - £1 printing costs!) from several reputable websites.

Why would the replacement tenant pay less? Unless OP is very unlucky and has a super rip-off landlord charging way above market rent. Summer accommodation is much in demand in London. Often by students (as I've already stated there are many language courses and other summer courses in London, and postgrads) so no risk of overstaying and if they are full-time students, no council tax liability. In any event the tenant/s would be responsible for council tax unless the property was empty so not the landlord's problem anyhow (unless an HMO in which case the landlord pays council tax regardless of who lives there, student or not).

I'm sure OP does now understand about fixed term - although why castigate him for being young(ish) and away from home for the first time (nice to see compassion and empathy!). Sometimes it helps having some advice to give a boast to confidence to take positive action - we all need that at times. And unless he is studying housing law, being a student doesn't mean expertise in this. And things have changed. With expanded student numbers there are less places in Halls of Residences, which in the past generally housed all or most first years. And no doubt student housing advice/general advice services are under more pressure with less time to help.
In any event many people of all ages sometimes have changed circumstances and it is shame to think that all landlords are not decent, approachable people willing to agree reasonable solutions.

And as for extended terms on Halls of Residences, unless things have changed in the last year or so, the majority still do not offer leases over the summer (despite the wish by many students who may want to stay on longer, especially postgrads), and those that do, have never had any problem with allowing re-assignments.
Generally however, those that do offer 12-month leases are specifically for postgrads who are studying for the whole 12 months.

tbs624

Martha66 wrote: »

Not ending up with a CCJ and lack of reference is precisely why I recommended OP approach their landlord and try to agree a solution (hopefully easily achievable if a reasonable landlord).

You still presented "walking away" as an option if the LL refuses to oblige the T's request for an early release. If you had balanced that with the third option of "you could just recognise that its only for 10-12 weeks and fulfil your obligations like an adult" , then I probably wouldn't have highlighted that part of your post.

Martha66 wrote: »

…..if the OP advertises himself and shows the house himself, the costs would be low - a credit check does not cost much. And all documents such as tenancy agreements and deed of assignments are available free as templates to download and print out (so perhaps 50p - £1 printing costs!) from several reputable websites.

LLs with a valuable asset would not generally choose to download an AST from the internet, especially not as a way of saving money for a T who does not want to meet their legal obligations under a contract. A comprehensive credit check and referencing will cost around £50-75 and, whilst the current T may indeed volunteer to advertise and show potential replacements round, any new T still has to be acceptable to the LL. Finding a replacement can be time-consuming & costly. If the tenancy began before Oct 1st 2008 then the LL will find that he has to pay out for an EPC to be done for the new T. If he uses one of the non-custodial tenancy deposit schemes he will have to pay another registration fee for the new tenant’s deposit……….

Martha66 wrote: »

Why would the replacement tenant pay less? Unless OP is very unlucky and has a super rip-off landlord charging way above market rent.

If s/he needs to get a replacement T in asap the LL sometimes has to be prepared to negotiate, and in some areas rent levels have fallen recently. However that original FT contract protected both the LL and the T from rents either increasing or decreasing locally for a set period - the original T contracted to pay x £ per month until expiry on a rent which may well have been in line with the market conditions that prevailed at the start of the tenancy.

Martha66 wrote: »

Summer accommodation is much in demand in London. Often by students (as I've already stated there are many language courses and other summer courses in London, and postgrads) so no risk of overstaying ..

Really? No -one ever overstays their student visa, or decides that they like London so much they don’t want to leave? You have a very simplistic view of property letting.

Martha66 wrote: »

and if they are full-time students, no council tax liability. In any event the tenant/s would be responsible for council tax unless the property was empty so not the landlord's problem anyhow (unless an HMO in which case the landlord pays council tax regardless of who lives there, student or not).

Again, too simplistic - if a temporary student is not "solely and mainly resident", if their course is for less than 21 hrs pw or less than 24 weeks in duration then they may well have a personal liability for CT rather than qualifying for an exemption, but if there is just a one day gap between full time student occupants then the LL becomes liable for the Council Tax for any intervening tenant-less period . More paperwork - more time - time=money.

Martha66 wrote: »

I'm sure OP does now understand about fixed term - although why castigate him for being young(ish) and away from home for the first time (nice to see compassion and empathy!).

Was your degree in drama? There is no “castigation for being young and away from home for the first time” : the fact is that the OP freely signed a legal contract and now wants to renege. It has nothing to do with a need for “compassion & empathy” - the OP has not indicated that s/he is returning for reasons of ill health or family catastrophe, merely that the other 2 occupants are going to their homes in the summer & that s/he wants to go to his/hers. Have you considered compassion or empathy for the LL who may perhaps be letting out a property they couldn’t sell, or using their rental income to fund care home fees for an elderly parent and thought that having signed a legal contract they were okay through until the expiry? Would you be as tolerant if the LL were young and had simply changed his or her mind and wanted the T to leave early? I suspect not.

Martha66 wrote: »

Sometimes it helps having some advice to give a boast to confidence to take positive action - we all need that at times. And unless he is studying housing law, being a student doesn't mean expertise in this. And things have changed. With expanded student numbers there are less places in Halls of Residences, which in the past generally housed all or most first years. !!

And sometimes it helps to be told to live in the real world, to be a person of your word, to stick by a contractual obligation. Most ASTs will contain the magical phrase “this is a legal document - please seek advice if you are unsure of your obligations” and I would expect most people capable of qualifying to go to University to do this before they sign upto any contract .Don’t know how long it is since you were at Uni. but most students tend to move out into private rentals in their 2nd year so it’s a useful skill to acquire.

Martha66 wrote: »

In any event many people of all ages sometimes have changed circumstances and it is shame to think that all landlords are not decent, approachable people willing to agree reasonable solutions.

Most LLs will try to work through with a T who wants to leave early but my objection was to your suggestion that it was OK to walk away from a legal obligation if all else failed. That is still poor advice - people who are over 18 are *adults* and can use the whole University experience, including dealing with legal contracts, as a useful basis for the rest of their adult life. Perhaps you personally see it as acceptable for people to wriggle out of their legal obligations whenever it suits, simply because they have changed their mind?

Martha66 wrote: »

….And as for extended terms on Halls of Residences, unless things have changed in the last year or so, the majority still do not offer leases over the summer (despite the wish by many students who may want to stay on longer, especially postgrads), and those that do, have never had any problem with allowing re-assignments.

Yes, some of the University Halls do not offer leases that run across the summer - precisely because the University wants to make use of them for their summer courses. (Accom fees will often be payable until the end of July, even though the full time students finished their exams in June - the point there was that it is not only private LLs who charge students for periods when they are not present) A key point is that you don’t seem to understand property letting/tenancy law - University-controlled Halls of Residence are not let under AST (Assured Shorthold Tenancy) agreements, therefore they do not face the same potential difficulties should an occupant fail to move out on the agreed date.

Hopefully, however, the OP will find a way to negotiate a replacement T who is acceptable to his/her LL and learns from the experience to check before signing on the dotted line.