Appeal against Redundancy

Debt_Free_Chick

For your appeal, you need to focus on the criteria/skills matrix used to score you both. You need to press for this and this must be the focus of your appeal. Where are you with the appeal? If you've submitted an appeal, can you tell us what you said/wrote?

The other stuff is not relevant. Sorry, but I can see that it is to you, but it won't "stand up in Court". For example, the alleged bullying incidents will not be relevant unless these allegations were upheld and appear on your colleagues record. Even then, they might not prevent her from out-scoring you.

Similarly, the fact that you trained her counts for nothing Sorry, but if she can now do the job, that's all that matters.

Her longer service might well be a "tie-breaker" too.

I think you stand a chance of getting more money, but it's more likely to be one month's extra pay, not three. These things are very difficult to quantify, but I would guess that £3,000 is more generous than the statutory minimum ....

Your employer will not want to go to Tribunal. For what it's worth, I think they might be scared of the Age Discrimination legislation, but I'll bet they can score your colleague higher than you on other criteria too, to cover their tracks.

What do you want to get out of this? More money? Or your job?

Lucias_mum

DFC - Thank you for your reply and time in helping me with this.

I have not submitted an appeal or prepared it yet - I am waiting for my employer to give me another date. The fact that you think my employer will not want to go to a Tribunal makes me feel a lot better - personally I am now so disheartened at everything that has been going on that I would be prepared to take the money and go - I don't want to work for an employer who treats me like a disposable asset - they are not a nice firm to work for anyway but with the current climate being as it is I am scared of having to try and find another job particularly in my line of work.

Do you suggest that I mention at my appeal that I would be prepared to take an extra months wages on top of redundancy pay and see what they say or would this prejudice me in any way?

Debt_Free_Chick

Lucias_mum wrote: »

DFC - Thank you for your reply and time in helping me with this.

I have not submitted an appeal or prepared it yet - I am waiting for my employer to give me another date. The fact that you think my employer will not want to go to a Tribunal makes me feel a lot better - personally I am now so disheartened at everything that has been going on that I would be prepared to take the money and go - I don't want to work for an employer who treats me like a disposable asset - they are not a nice firm to work for anyway but with the current climate being as it is I am scared of having to try and find another job particularly in my line of work.

Do you suggest that I mention at my appeal that I would be prepared to take an extra months wages on top of redundancy pay and see what they say or would this prejudice me in any way?

I think the first thing we need to do is to get your appeal/grounds sorted

If you have a strong appeal, it will make your employer feel even more "nervous" about going to Tribunal and they will probably offer you more money, simply to dissuade you from going to Tribunal

Have you submitted a request for appeal in writing? If so, what did it say?

Lucias_mum

I was notified by e-mail that I had been selected. Within the e-mail I was told I had a right of appeal but they didn't give me a date to leave. I was given the name of the Senior Partner to appeal to. I e-mailed this Senior Partner to say that I wished to appeal. Since then she has cancelled two appeal dates !!! So I am still waiting

I have continuously enquired about the selection process and how I was chosen but my e-mails are just getting ignored.

Poppy9

Even though your solicitor cannot be present he can surely advise you on your grounds for appeal. Also if you have engaged a solicitor can he not challenge whether he is allowed to be present given that the person hearing the appeal has a legal background?

I don't envy you go through this process. One of my friend appealed her salary in her job. She had the support of the union who backed her case and she proved HR had erroneous data held on their records etc. First appeal to Head of dept. failed, second appeal in grievance process failed, final appeal in the process also failed. To date they have not provided her with a reason for refusing her appeal she just had a letter saying it had been refused. The local union didn't know what to do so now she has had to go to the regional office. They don't seem interested in helping "white collar" workers to the same degree they do "blue collar" workers.

*jo_jo*

Not sure if this has already been answered so apologies if I have covered old ground - only found this part of the forum today! I work as an Employment Law Specialist and take claims for clients to Tribunals. The relevant legislation regarding the legal right to be accompanied is within s.10 of the Employment Relations Act http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts1999/ukpga_19990026_en_1#pb3-l1g10

*jo_jo*

Lucias_mum

Thanks Jo Jo. Are you able to comment on the rest of my thread and my chances of success at an Employment Tribunal ?

*jo_jo*

Hi,

I think DFC has been giving excellent advice. My main concern on having read the posts is ensuring your time limits are complied with for Tribunal action. This may have already been covered but you only have three months less one day from the date of a dismissal to make your claim to the Tribunal. This is only ever extended in rare circumstances - the main one being if you could show an appeal was reasonably continuing at the time the deadline expires - i.e. the date for the appeal meeting was after the deadline would have expired for example. If you are approaching your deadline make the claim of unfair dismissal regardless, DFC is right you should have appealed beforehand, but it is better than missing your opportunity entirely.

In terms of the redundancy itself, stautory pay in the absence of your contract dictating any pay would be 1.5 weeks pay for each complete year of employment aged 41 and over (after your 41st birthday), and 1 week for when you were aged 22-41. In your case this would probably be 11.5 weeks pay? Your stautory notice (again in the absence of preferable contractual terms) would be 11 weeks pay if you had been employed for 11 complete years. Pay in lieu of notice is net, redundancy is gross. At Tribunal (not if you were paid directly beforehand) a week's pay is capped at £350 per week gross as of February 2009, so this could make a significant difference in what you might receive.

If you were to go to a Tribunal you would be arguing under Employment Rights Act 1996 (as amended) that although the redundancy reason may have been a fair reason to dismiss, that the employer did not behave reasonably given the circumstances- the relevant section of law is 98(4):http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts1996/ukpga_19960018_en_11#pt10-ch1-pb3-l1g98

I think you would have an average prospect of success if you could show that you were unfairly selected, or that the criteria used to choose you were not objective. However, that may not be easy to do without you trying to gather evidence, such as documents or witnesses. What you would actually get for unfair dismissal if you won your claim would be a loss of earnings (known as a compensatory award) from the date of your dismissal to the date of the hearing and for a fixed period in the future (often limited to around 26 weeks) if you had tried to mitigate your losses (search for new work) but had not been successful, or you found another job paying less.

My recommendation is to seek advice immediately from either:
ACAS -08457 47 47 47
Community Legal Advice - 0845 345 4345

...or your solicitor if specific advice about the merits of running a claim is needed. Best of luck

Lucias_mum

Thanks Jo Jo.

I am now worried. I haven't been given a date to leave yet - only notice to say that I have been selected and I am entitled to lodge an appeal. When does the Tribunal timeline start ticking - is it when you know you've been officially selected for redundancy or when you are given a date to leave? I was informed by e-mail on or about 27 February that I had been chosen and had the chance to appeal. Do I therefore have three months from this date to lodge a complaint with the Tribunal or is it from the date when my appeal result is given to me? If the former is the case then I know why my employers are now continually cancelling my appeal dates :eek:

getmore4less

Sure the date for any tribuneral is dismisal date. 3 months extended to 6 if you still have a greivence.

http://www.employmenttribunals.gov.uk/FormsGuidance/makingAClaim.htm

Did you get your initial offer in writing before they went to formal selection it could indicate a bias in the process