Council Home Rental Problems

TerryandGaby

I've posted a thread earlier in the process, but would like to get a few more thoughts as to where we stand.

My girlfriend's father passed away in November. He had terminal cancer, and myself and my girlfriend moved in two months prior to care for him, as he was gravely ill.

Since his death, we have wanted to stay in the house. It has been in the family for thirty years previously, and my girlfriend has lived there all but three years of her life.

Before his death, we tried to get added onto the rent book. We were refused, as apparantly it was changed before, from Mr & Mrs ******* to solely Mr *******, when his wife passed away. I thought this was mad, to be honest.

We were told to leave before Dec 31st, though I rang pleading to allow us some extra time. We were allowed this, and now pay an "occupation" charge, which they are at pains to remind us is not rent, and if we don't accept one of three properties we will be evicted.

Now, when I was working, we were always planning to move into a private rental, and had been looking. Last week, however, I lost my job.

My question is simply, have we any chance of staying here?

poppysarah

No. Accept one of the three they offer you.

devils_vixen

I was always under the impression that if you are resident in a council house for more than 6 months with the person whose house this is then in the event of their death/absence the house is passed to you? Maybe I am wrong but there is a thing called a transfer of tenancy that could be applied for (i think) there is where I live and had I known at the time, I would have went for it. The council didn't inform me that this was a procedure, it was about a year down the line when I found out that this is a possibility. I was fuming!

TerryandGaby

My main argument revolves around anyone's right to their own home. This is a small but nice house, which has been well looked after over many years. I don't understand why we're being turfed out. It could have been...

1. We were both earning. That was true, I have just been made redundant.

or

2. Someone deserved the house more. Well, I don't see that. Why can't council houses stay in a family? Our only downfall has been not having the money to purchase the house from the council in the first place, which I now realise is more or less the only way to stay in a council house from generation to generation, and it's no surprise that approximately 90% of the houses on this street are bought. You shouldn't have to to provide a home for your family.

poppysarah

Because it's a council house not your family house.

It's very sad - especially because you're dealing with grief as well as slightly harsh rules - but see what they offer you and move.

If you're determined go take legal advice about your chances.

before_hollywood

i'm sure the system used to allow houses to stay in families then the system was changed to prevent it?

p00hsticks

before_hollywood wrote: »

i'm sure the system used to allow houses to stay in families then the system was changed to prevent it?

It still does, but

a) the family member has to have been living in the property for at least the last twelve months

and

b) only one 'assignment' from one name ot another is usually allowed - and it sounds as if they was used up when the mother died and the house was put into the fathers sole name

More info here;

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/HomeAndCommunity/SocialHousingAndCareHomes/CouncilHousing/DG_10022543

beingjdc

TerryandGaby wrote: »

You shouldn't have to to provide a home for your family.

Eh? Why shouldn't you?

Why should some people get a secure tenancy of a subsidised house and others not, just because of the fact their parents had one?

For the record, I support higher inheritance tax too and less tax on what people earn for themselves, so I don't think rich kids should get everything on a plate either.

tbs624

In these circumstances the Council could possibly *choose* to offer another tenancy to your GF but they are not obliged to. AFAIAA, the t/f of the tenancy into her father's sole name is a "survivorship" which is held to be a form of succession, so that is the standard one succession effectively used up.

Even if the tenancy hadn't already been passed on once, the fact that you say your GF moved back in to the property just two months before her father passed away would probably have meant that she did not fulfil the criteria for succession which is usually 12 months unbroken occupancy.

You say, however, that the Council has offered you one of three other properties so, as you say you were thinking of moving anyway, you need to decide whether to find a private LL who will take Ts on LHA or go with one of the three offered. Bear in mind that other families who need housing are probably being held up by your indecision, and they may be in a far worse personal situation than you.

Unfortunately, describing the property as having "been in the family for 30 years" is neither here nor there - that term is normally used to indicate a property owned by a family but here the Council are the owners/LLs and you have to work within their rules.

If your GF wants independent advice, she should have the original tenancy agreement to hand & ring Shelter on 0808 800 444 (7 days, 8-8) Here's what they say on their website:

Can I pass on my tenancy when I die?

If you have a joint tenancy, the other joint tenant will automatically take over the tenancy when you die. But if you are the only tenant, there are rules about who the tenancy can be passed on to. The legal process is called succession and can only happen once, unless your tenancy agreement allows for more than one succession.

Your tenancy can be passed on to your spouse or civil partner, as long as s/he has been living in your home at the time of your death. If you are not married or registered as a civil partner, your partner or another member of your family may be able to take over the tenancy instead, providing s/he has been living with you for at least one year.

squinty

Being blunt you have no right to remain in the property.

As others have said there is a right of succession for secure tenancies - however this does not apply in your case for two reasons:

Firstly, there can only be one succession per tenancy and this has been used when the tenancy transferred from a joint to a single

Secondly, even if this had not happened the rules of succession are that it applies only to certain family memebers who have lived with the tenant for 12 months before thy died. This does not apply in your case.

To be clear - this is not a policy of the council but is laid out in legislation.

I disagree slightly with tbs624. As there are no succession rights the council cannot chose to offer you the property. The poprerty must be allocated folowing the councils published allocations policy.

Looking back to the original post. The council was quite right in not allowing your names to be added to the tenancy. A secure tenancy cannot be assigned expect in a few prescribed circumstances - none of which apply in your case. Again this is legislation - not council rules.

The council are also correct not to charge you rent. It is making a charge for Mesne Profit (i.e. for use and occupation of the porperty). This is a small but important distinction - if the council had accepted 'rent' from you you may have implied that the had created a tenancy. By making this distinction the council has ensured this cannot happen.

Despite your obvious anger it does sound like the council are actually bending over backwards to help you. From what you have said you are not in any priority need group yet the council are still trying to assist. They have no obligation to do this.

I do suspect through that assuming you are a childless couple that they will offer you a flat rather than the family sized accommodation where you now live. Your choice is to either accept one of their offers, or if you really prefer a larger property rent one privately.