E10 Tariff / Negotiating with Supplier

Overbilled

I have been using Economy 10 (sometimes called heatwise) to heat underfloor storage heaters. I recently discovered that for the past year or so my supplier has been billing me using an incorrect (higher) tariff - they've been billing me as if I was receiving 15.5 hours of offpeak power.

I just want them to recalculate my bill using the correct tariffs and refund the over charges. But, so far, no one at the supplier has been able to tell me what is the correct tariff for E10. The customer service staff (and the staff in another department) say that it's complicated because there have been price changes etc.

Instead, they have suggested that I speak to a manager and negotiate a lump-sum rebate. That would be fine with me but I need to have some idea about the E10 tariff so that I can make an estimate of what the rebate should be. I haven't been able to find the E10 tariff on any of the suppliers' websites or the usual switching sites or through Google. I did

So, I have two questions for you:

1. Any advice about negotiating a lump sum rebate to cover their mistaken bills?

2. If you are on E10, please have a look at you own bill(s) and tell me what is the E10 tariff where you are, current or past.

For the tariff, I'd like to know:

standing charge
normal rate 1(up to 250 or 900 kwh)
normal rate 2 (over 250 or 900 kwh)
off-peak rate

Thanks!

stewie_griffin

Do you definately have an Economy 10 meter or do you have a single rate credit meter and also an RHT (restricted hours tariff) meter that your under floor heating is connected to. Who is your supplier (and also host supplier) and what is the name of the tariff you have been charged on?

Fire_Fox

If you were supposed to get ten hours of off-peak (cheap rate) electricity and you have been billed for fifteen hours of off-peak electricity (so only nine hours of use at day rate), how is it you think you have been overcharged??

Overbilled

thanks for your replies. it's a long story involving incompatible metres, radio time switches, and tariffs. i won't bore you with the technical details, as they don't really matter. the supplier has already admitted that they have overbilled me using the wrong tariff. i really just want to know what different companies are charging for E10 tariffs, so that i can estimate the amount of the over billing and be informed when it comes to negotiating a rebate. any ideas?

storminbalder

You tell us what you pay, and i'll tell you mine!

Overbilled

i'd be happy to tell you. but that's the problem. i don't know what i should be paying. the lower level staff can't or won't tell me the E10 tariff, even though the company supports E10.

Premier_2

Who's your current supplier and what region are you in?

storminbalder

Overbilled wrote: »

i'd be happy to tell you. but that's the problem. i don't know what i should be paying. the lower level staff can't or won't tell me the E10 tariff, even though the company supports E10.

OK i'll go first.

E-on Standard in East Midlands with Heatwise Tariff (10 hours stored heating 1-5am, 1-4pm & 8-10pm).

Standard.

First 900 25.02p
After 900 10.66p

Heatwise.

6.35p

Heatwise standing charge 10.02p per day.

Fire_Fox

Have you written to the customer services department detailing the problem (not complaint) and requesting pricing for their E10 tariff, from x date to present? On the phone you will just get a basic assistant who probably won't have come across this problem before.

markowen58

Economy 10 isnt Heatwise.

Economy 10 originally emerged in the PES 10 area (Eastern Energy) as an alternative to economy 7 to provide a ‘boost’ to the storage heaters during the day. At roughly the same time other PES areas came up with differing products such as Heatwise, WeatherCall, SuperTariff, SuperDeal, WarmWise, etc. all of which provide a different electrical heating setup to E7 meters.

Now the E10 in the PES 10 area is in fact two meters in one. It requires two supply numbers (Meter Point Admin Numbers, MPANs). The first half of the meter is attached to you lights and sockets, etc to record your normal usage, the second part of the meter is only for the heating circuit and has your heaters or water storage heater attached to it.

Recently I believe OFGEM required suppliers to offer Economy 10 in all regions to allow customers greater choice between suppliers regarding these ‘heating’ meters. The way suppliers solved this was to reprogram E7 meters to record 10 hours off peak. However E7 meters only have one MPAN, therefore the off peak ‘heating’ periods actually record all usage (from watching TV to the washing machine).

Heatwise meters are slightly different in that although they still have 2x MPANs the first part of the meter that is attached to the sockets/lights is a full E7 meter and you get 7 hours of off peak at night (E10 in PES 10 only had 5 hours) equally the off peak is recorded on three different registers and at two different rates.

Either way. ALWAYS ensure that the meter you have matches the heating system in your home. Or you will get some crazy bills as your heating is recorded on peak rates. Those peak rates are higher anyway to offset the off peak rates. An electrician should be able to help you on this.

Unfortunately suppliers or at least their call centre staff aren’t overly aware of the complexities of matching a meter to the heating system and have no knowledge of the setup of your house. It is your responsibility to ensure that the heating system matches the meter. A supplier will quite happily change a meter over for you, but if your heating is recording at a peak rate, that is your fault, it is no different to simply choosing to plug in a number of standalone heaters at peak times.

The same lack of call centre knowledge unfortunately also applies to tariff prices, although they should have a copy of them somewhere, but bear in mind that there are two E10 systems currently in place in PES 10 and elsewhere so there should be two different sets of E10 prices.

The same confusions over meters also results in a number of people switching suppliers without realising that they cannot. If you are on a Heatwise, SuperTariff, WeatherCall meter, etc. then you cannot go onto online, fixed price, capped price, etc tariffs. You’ll get a large bill and no end of hassle only to end up with the same supplier you had in the first place as they are the only supplier to support the tariff specifically.

I don’t want to belittle call centre staff as I was one, what you have to consider is the sheer complexity of metering across the country and therefore number of tariffs and heating systems available is enough to cause anyone a headache.

Hope this clarifies E10/HW meters, etc.

I should point out I worked for E.ON in their Electric Meter Exchange and Tariffs department and had to sort these issues out on a daily basis. However I now work for E.ON in a different capacity and should point out this post is my own personal opinion and not that of E.ON’s to avoid me hopefully from getting into trouble.

Rajeev

Hi, so which one is the best provider for E10 tariff ?

I am on powergen and they charged me following on my last bill (Greater London)
Charges

Normal primary units used
247 kWh at 25.15p each

62.12

Normal secondary units used
573 kWh at 10.31p each

59.08

RHT Normal units used
3021 kWh at 7.36p each

222.35

Standing Charge
100 days at 7.81p per day

7.81

is this good, bad or very bad ?