Public-private wage divide gets 50% wider

Sir_Humphrey

Our head of division doesn't even have a secretary, so I don't see much evidence of empire building here. I (as an EO) have no secretarial support. How many bank managers spend time photocopying?

chewmylegoff

Sir_Humphrey wrote: »

Our head of division doesn't even have a secretary, so I don't see much evidence of empire building here. I (as an EO) have no secretarial support. How many bank managers spend time photocopying?

the lack of secretarial support in the civil service is one of the stupidest things i have ever come across. in my previous role we had approximately 60 people and one secretary between them. the amount of wasted time that resulted from this was horrendous, and is one of the biggest reasons why it takes so long to get everything done.

now i'm in quasi public sector, doing almost exactly the same job. we have 1 secretary and 1 admin in a team of 8. things happen so much faster here, despite fewer people being employed to work at the 'coal face'.

chewmylegoff

BACKFRMTHEEDGE wrote: »

There are plenty of useful things people can do in the public sector for £15000. Indeed, the cost of having someone on the dole is not £4k - you haven't factored in the cost of crime and social unrest......

or housing benefit.

macaque_2

BACKFRMTHEEDGE wrote: »

This is rubbish. You obviously have never been near a school in years and get your views about Education from a Tory newspaper.

Ultimately you have judge these things by results (not league tables and statistics).

Last year we advertised for a degree qualified engineer. There were plenty of applications. My preference was to use home grown talent if possible. In the end not a single person from a UK school made it onto the short list. The UK applicants were far too familiar, they sent CVs without covering notes, their spelling was bad (in an age of spell checks there is no excuse for this), their grammar was poor and very few of them could hold an engaging conversation. Added to this there is a growing question mark about their academic capabilities. Many UK Universities are openly admitting that their first year science courses are turning in remedial classes.

Perhaps you can argue with good inside knowledge. I can argue with good 'outside knowledge' however. What I have seen is that quality of people leaving UK schools in terms of discipline, self motivation, social skills and academic capability has suffered badly in recent years.

Old_Slaphead

Quote:
Originally Posted by BACKFRMTHEEDGE
As I said, you haven't been near a school in decades and you have no idea what you are talking about.:rolleyes:



My response :
My partner has worked in inner city schools & the education system for the past 25 years.

My brother in law has been a teacher for 40 years in total - the last 15 as deputy head.

My company recruits schoolleavers - their standard of education is deteriorating each year....many can't even spell and/or don't have basic numeracy skills.

What experience have you had that's given you such a rose-tinted view of what's going on (Labour spin machine)??

Seems this topic is being argued on more than one front. I've yet to receive a response from BACKFRMTHEEDGE but am looking forward to a constructive appraisal of how the provision education has materially improved in the last 10 years.

helenjg

Cannon_Fodder wrote: »

How lucky it is that the stats mentioned in the opening post are here to avoid any accidental bias from anecdotal experiences...

I think we have established that the original statistic is so general it means nothing. What I’m talking about is like for like jobs - I’m not saying that I get paid as much as someone working on a production line.

I think you will find that many public sector jobs require some element of vocational higher education - in my department the masters/degree holders outnumber the non degree holders by 2:1.

Now look at the companies you’ve worked in and think about what vocational degree holders such as engineers, qualified accountants, legal teams were earning.

Cannon_Fodder

But that's all anecdotal, dependant on so many factors, such as the coincidence of what industry you are in, the location - near to a decent university, what choice an individual makes for their career etc etc etc.

Totally unable to rely upon such anecdotals. Totally impossible to find two people exactly the same, to make accurate comparisons.


At least the stats have the benefit of being in measured millions, smoothing out regional/age/career/bias factors etc etc etc.


i.e. your Master/degree example; How many jobs actually NEED a degree?

Or is it just bias of the Establishment, to recruit "their kind of people"...a kind of institutional snobbishness?

chris_spackman

baby_boomer wrote: »

Based on this thread, Sir Humphrey seems to have a 2 hour lunch hour in which he is allowed to post to websites without fear of disciplinary action. [If he replies to this post it's longer :rotfl: ]

Is that normal civil service / government employee practice? Or just a senior civil servant perk? Or maybe the civil service just hasn't got round to proper supervision of its employees?

Or is SH a parasite employed by the civil service - at taxpayers' expense - to counter "dangerous views" on websites?

................getting paid £100k plus benefits and expenses(taking taxpayers money and buying things some hard working folk could never afford), pension whilst hard working folk are having theirs wiped out by Bankers and Brown & Co and not stepping foot in the pub as he would not be able to relate to a single person in it.

chris_spackman

Sir_Humphrey wrote: »

I suppose you are unemployed then?

I suppose you are a !!!! then?

Self employed before you ask so i can do what i want when i want and the way in which Labour have !!!!ed this country good and hard i'll have more time on my hands and you Sir will i hope get a good sized 15 up your backside when Cameron gets his hands on the keys to No 10 and gets rid of this lack of respect for Taxpayers money.

Sir_Humphrey

chris_spackman wrote: »

I suppose you are a !!!! then?

Self employed before you ask so i can do what i want when i want and the way in which Labour have !!!!ed this country good and hard i'll have more time on my hands and you Sir will i hope get a good sized 15 up your backside when Cameron gets his hands on the keys to No 10 and gets rid of this lack of respect for Taxpayers money.

Blimey, I rattled someone's cage door. I suppose the resort to ad hominem attacks is equivalent to conceding this point. I also suppose that private sector offices consist of monks who never talk to each other (not my experience when I worked in the private sector). Spending a minute typing out a forum response is no different to talking with workmates.


If I earned 100k a year, I would not be on a Moneysaving website.