Fortis travel insurance problems claiming for a d*mn expensive camera.

Gamegal

We have free annual European travel insurance with Fortis with our joint account with Alliance & Leicester.

We've recently returned from Spain's Costa Blanca where our hire car's quarter light passenger window was smashed lunchtime Dec 23rd, its central locking disabled & the concealed boot accessed. Personal baggage containing, amongst other items, my husband's expensive Nikon digicam, was stolen. (We actually were parked on a main road in car spaces a couple of mins stroll from the first shop in a village).

A local police car went by just after we found the car had been broken into & they were witness to the window having been smashed. We also reported the incident to the Spanish police & obtained a report.

When my husband rang Fortis a woman said the camera wasn't covered as Fortis classed it as a 'valuable' & it should've been in a safety deposit box when not on his person !! My husband argued with her saying a camera was one thing most would have in their baggage. The woman said that if Fortis paid out to everyone 'losing' a camera they'd pay thousands out !!! (I was listening in on the conversation to save my husband from having to tell me everything that she'd said).

So, my husband filled in the claim form without claiming for the camera he paid over £300 for three years ago & sent it Friday.

I was perusing the Fortis policy booklet & I fully believe that, as the camera was concealed inside the baggage & whoever stole the baggage could not have known a camera was in it, it surely must be covered, up to the £300 maximum for valuables. I can understand if the thing was on the rear seat in full view, saying 'nick me, I'm an expensive camera'. We have therefore just written a letter with all this on ready to send tomorrow.

Anyone had dealings with Fortis ? Are they totally fair. We believe we were misinformed & do have a claim for the digicam.

Thanks. :hello:

FlameCloud

Assuming you have this policy- (only one I could find)

http://www.fortisinsurance.co.uk/images/pdf/326.pdf

I'm afraid I think they are in the right-

1. Page 12 clearly details Photographic equipment as valuables.
2. Page 21, under the actual peril-

"Loss of, theft of or damage to

valuables you are not carrying with
you unless you have kept them in
locked accommodation, a safe or

a safety deposit box"


So basically, you'd be covered if they were stolen from you when you were carrying but not if they were left somewhere other than the three areas listed.

dacouch

You may find that they are covered by your home insurers if you have "unspecified personal possessions / belongings cover". Home Insurers tend to have less restrictions on their policy, have a higher single article limit than £300 and normally pay on a "new for old basis"

Give your home insurers a ring and see if its covered.

payless

Interesting inn my AXA policy Baggage is covered in a locked boot, but valuables ( inc camera) are not.. but in their defination of baggage - its includes valuables!

Gamegal

I've not been receiving any email notifications of further posts so sorry I've not answered. Fortunately I keep links to my posts so I just checked this one & another, both had new posts.

Dacouch We didn't take that optional extra insurance so no, not covered by buildings/contents insurance.

FlameCloud If we'd claimed we'd been mugged we'd have been covered AND we wouldn't have had to pay £50 each excess either.

Anyway we've argued with Fortis about this as the policy booklet says we were covered for all in the personal baggage that one would normally take on holiday. I do realise that it says elsewhere that a camera is a 'valuable' & it also says 'valuables' are not covered if left in an unattended vehicle BUT it does not say excluding cameras when mentioning all one would normally take on holiday & I find that very misleading & ambiguous. However Fortis think it's clear & got shirty on the phone with me over it just yesterday. They've sent details of how we now contact the financial ombudsman so we may seeing as it's free. I guess we won't have a leg to stand on but I think the policy booklet needs a serious revamp. My opinion anyway.

They have sent us a cheque for all other items, deducting £50 excess each & 10% wear & tear for 1 year old prescription glasses for us both. We throw all receipts in a drawer for a year so had receipts for relatively new things lost & sent instructions for hubby's razor & Specsavers wrote letters with details.

If it happens again, God forbid, we intend saying we were mugged which is what someone said we ought to do before we reported theft to police. It makes decent folk turn into blatant liars to get what should be covered.

We still are owed 180€ by our Spanish insurers who are covering us for replacement locks as house keys were stolen too. I've had to email the agent who obviously hasn't been following it up as they said they'd need to contact the insurers.

:silenced: Grrrrrr........

N79

If it happens again, God forbid, we intend saying we were mugged which is what someone said we ought to do before we reported theft to police. It makes decent folk turn into blatant liars to get what should be covered.

Just to point out that it would be a really bad idea to make false reports to the police in foreign countries - you have no idea of knowing what the penalties would be if they find out. In many countries this could include jail.

If you want cover for your valuables in these circumstances next time, would it not be easier to take out appropriate cover rather than committing fraud?

dacouch

Please bear in mind an Insurance Policy is in effect a contract, the Insurers agree to pay out subject to the terms of the contract providing you abide by the terms of the contract.

All Travel Insurers I know of have a similar restriction on their policy and the majority of home policies restrict theft of items from cars to being locked in a glove compartment or boot. This is because these type of claims are very frequent and that it is felt that leaving valuable items on view in a car eg not in a boot in effect encourarges their theft.

If you complain to the Ombudsman he will side with Fortis.

I personally recommend all clients read their Travel Policy when I issue a policy as they contain important information on what is and isn't covered. Incidently the Fortis Policy actually is quite wide cover and is one of the more clearly worded policies.

As stated by N79 it would not be wise to lie to the police as in some countries they take pride in their crime statistics as it effects tourism so they investigate crimes very thoroughly. In addition as well as misleading the police which no doubt is a crime in that country you would also be defrauding the Insurer in this country.

This post is in no way meant to be having a go at you as I'm sorry you have lost out but a policy remember it is in effect a contract covers some things and does not cover other things. The other things that often are not covered are excluded as if they were included the Insurers would receive so many claims they would have to push everyones premiums up and this would not go down well with the rest of the customers. The theft from a vehicle restrictions are a very common thing with travel insurers. In fact many Travel Insurers would have paid out none of your claim as they would say the items have to be locked in a secure and locked boot. By this they mean one that can only be accessed by the key through the boot lid no by lifting the parcel shelf up

bitsnbytes

I had a similar experience, whilst on holiday I had my expensive mobile phone pda (O2 XDA stellar) stolen from my waist pouch in a bus. Cheeky guys, I didn't even feel them open my waist pouch

Anyway, I too had travel insurance with fortis (A&L current account). However, they said the same thing that mobile phones are not covered. Luckily for me my home insurance (with groupama taken out through post office) does cover my mobile phone. However they only issue a cheque (minus the £100 excess) toward the value of the phone. I had a couple of questions regarding this:

1. Can I claim for loss of replacing sim cards and accessories on the mobile phone? It cost me £15 to replace my sim card and almost £100 for other bits and bobs on the phone (for eg. 16gb micro sd card etc). Can I claim for these? In hindsight I should have asked them this when I had made the claim, however I just want to be informed

2. From my findings, it seems the xda stellar which is only available via O2 is not available sim-free and only on a contract. In such a case how do they decide a settlement figure? Any ideas? Would they take into account the cost of a 18month contract?

3. Will this claim on my contents insurance affect my no-claims discount?

Any help will be greatly appreciated

bitsnbytes

bitsnbytes wrote: »

I too had travel insurance with fortis (A&L current account). However, they said the same thing that mobile phones are not covered.

Having read through the fortis T&C (Section 5, page 20). I think I could have argued that the XDA Stellar is more than a mobile phone since it is also a personal computer. Anyway, they say that the max claim amount is only £300 (minus the wear and tear and £35 excess) and the pda is definitely more than that.

Which brings to mind another question, can someone claim for a lost/stolen item on 2 different insurance policies? Is this legal? I know for sure that my life insurance policies do payout irrespecive of another payout in the event of death. But these could be different

Gamegal

dacouch wrote: »

Please bear in mind an Insurance Policy is in effect a contract, the Insurers agree to pay out subject to the terms of the contract providing you abide by the terms of the contract.

All Travel Insurers I know of have a similar restriction on their policy and the majority of home policies restrict theft of items from cars to being locked in a glove compartment or boot. This is because these type of claims are very frequent and that it is felt that leaving valuable items on view in a car eg not in a boot in effect encourarges their theft.

If you complain to the Ombudsman he will side with Fortis.

I personally recommend all clients read their Travel Policy when I issue a policy as they contain important information on what is and isn't covered. Incidently the Fortis Policy actually is quite wide cover and is one of the more clearly worded policies.

As stated by N79 it would not be wise to lie to the police as in some countries they take pride in their crime statistics as it effects tourism so they investigate crimes very thoroughly. In addition as well as misleading the police which no doubt is a crime in that country you would also be defrauding the Insurer in this country.

This post is in no way meant to be having a go at you as I'm sorry you have lost out but a policy remember it is in effect a contract covers some things and does not cover other things. The other things that often are not covered are excluded as if they were included the Insurers would receive so many claims they would have to push everyones premiums up and this would not go down well with the rest of the customers. The theft from a vehicle restrictions are a very common thing with travel insurers. In fact many Travel Insurers would have paid out none of your claim as they would say the items have to be locked in a secure and locked boot. By this they mean one that can only be accessed by the key through the boot lid no by lifting the parcel shelf up

To dacouch & N79: Firstly I actually am a very law abiding gal of 60 who wouldn't dream of lying & I said what I did about reporting a mugging in future rather than the items being taken from a car as I am flipping annoyed & frustrated, that's all, so ease up.


To dacouch Regarding above highlighted in red, if you'd read my 1st post I said the camera was in concealed locked boot, actually within our personal baggage !!

'We've recently returned from Spain's Costa Blanca where our hire car's quarter light passenger window was smashed lunchtime Dec 23rd, its central locking disabled & the concealed boot accessed. Personal baggage containing, amongst other items, my husband's expensive Nikon digicam, was stolen.'

Once the central locking was disarmed they could open the boot. The baggage was where it was meant to be !!

N79

Gamegal wrote: »

To dacouch & N79: Firstly I actually am a very law abiding gal of 60 who wouldn't dream of lying & I said what I did about reporting a mugging in future rather than the items being taken from a car as I am flipping annoyed & frustrated, that's all, so ease up.

I made no moral judgement in my post and do not think that I was hard on you so I do not know how I can "ease up". I just warned you (and any other forum readers who may read your post) of the consequences of your proposed course of action. Potentially flippant and off hand remarks often do not come accross as flippant or off hand in writing.

I live outside the UK. Where I live having your car broken into will result in you getting at most 5 minutes with a bored and uninterested reception desk police officer who will simply stamp a form for your insurance. If you are mugged then they will provide translators, an English speaking doctor, will launch a full investigation and you will be looked after and interviewed by sympathetic police officers. If they find out the mugging was fabricated then the best you could hope for would be deportation!

All I wanted to point out was that what seems like a white lie in the UK may have unexpected consequences if you involve foreign police.