Australians get $1000 for Christmas

DKLS

adr0ck wrote: »

the point is it costs a lot of money to bring children up

and those children will pay everyones pensions in the future when their working (and they will be paying a lot more in tax than you ever have or will do to support you)

I cant stand the phrase "Hard working families", the childless get nothing yet again.
Those children will NOT be paying my pension, I will have paid for that myself.

Having children is a choice, If I had my way I would incentivise not having kids this planet is way overpopulated.

mewbie_2

So any kid that doesn't get $1,000 of Xmas presents is going to feel short changed? "Hey Dad, how come I only got an orange and a second hand teletubby? And why are you kissing that woman who's not Mum?"

adr0ck

DKLS wrote: »

Those children will NOT be paying my pension, I will have paid for that myself.

Having children is a choice, If I had my way I would incentivise not having kids this planet is way overpopulated.

pensions don't work like that

you are currently paying for pensioners now

planet may be overpopulated but we are heading for a real pension crisis in the uk

the reason for this is people are living longer and not enough children are being born

thefellow

Some great comments.

But it's a feel good factor thing with me,i probaby would spend it over christmas.

Im just on such a low just now,i work my !!!! off for my family and every penny is counted for.

I work in a small family paint shop and you see painters coming in and telling you about cash in hand jobs etc etc etc.

Also i had about £500 saved up hoping to go to Australia to see family in 2010 but that was eaten up by fuel bills this early winter,

Sorry for going off on one but im so !!!!ed off!!!!

MrDT

adr0ck wrote: »

pensions don't work like that

you are currently paying for pensioners now

planet may be overpopulated but we are heading for a real pension crisis in the uk

the reason for this is people are living longer and not enough children are being born

Way I understood it was:

• The state pension is funded by NI payments of people currently in work
• Self invest pensions are available for those that want to ensure they won't be without in retirement

I read DKLS's post as "I am paying into a SIPP, as such I won't qualify for state benefits in my dotage." If there'll even be such a thing as a state pension come that time!

I believe we're seeing reverse evolution these days, survival of the laziest. So many kids born into families that have never worked, kids that grow into adults that will never work themselves. How will these people support and pay the pensions of the current working generation?

Generali

MrDT wrote: »

Way I understood it was:

• The state pension is funded by NI payments of people currently in work
• Self invest pensions are available for those that want to ensure they won't be without in retirement

I read DKLS's post as "I am paying into a SIPP, as such I won't qualify for state benefits in my dotage." If there'll even be such a thing as a state pension come that time!

I believe we're seeing reverse evolution these days, survival of the laziest. So many kids born into families that have never worked, kids that grow into adults that will never work themselves. How will these people support and pay the pensions of the current working generation?

That's how the UK's pension system is sold but it doesn't work like that.

If we look at the state pension. That is paid to all men over the age of 65 and all women over the age of 60 assuming they have made sufficient National Insurance payments during their working lives. This is funded from current taxation - no money was set aside to meet payments for state pensions today while the recipients were working.

No money is being put aside for tax payers today to meet the obligation the state has to pay them a state pension either. The future liability for those pensions is not included on the Government's balance sheet. The reason given is that the current Government is unable to force future Governments to follow a particular course of action under the (unwritten) British Constitution so it is impossible to state what the liability should be, if indeed there is any as a future Government could decide to scrap the state pension. The same reason has been given by Tory, Labour and (presumably as they brought in the state pension I believe) Liberal Governments.

Civil service pensions are very generous but also unfunded and the future liability unaccounted for. It is believed that the liability should be about GBP1,000,000,000,000! As a result, it is highly unlikely that younger Civil Servants will ever see the promised pensions.

Local Government employees also have very generous pension schemes. These are wholly funded I believe and so will be safe as long as the Government keeps its hands off. Unlikely IMO.

Private defined benefit schemes are mostly underfunded. I suspect that these schemes are going to be nationalised by stealth (eg by forcing them to buy a larger proportion of UK Government debt by changing asset allocation/risk rules).

Private defined contribution schemes are what they are. You and your boss put in some cash and you hope that you don't want to retire in the middle of a particularly nasty credit crunch when asset prices are down.

worrypants

DKLS wrote: »

I cant stand the phrase "Hard working families", the childless get nothing yet again.
Those children will NOT be paying my pension, I will have paid for that myself.

Having children is a choice, If I had my way I would incentivise not having kids this planet is way overpopulated.

could not agree more one oif the many reasons I left the Uk was the obscene amount of "my" money going on other peoples brats

why oh why should folk with no kids pay for other peoples!! if you choose not to overpopulate this already over populated planet then you should be rewarded for that !!

I will not pay for others kids that they cant afford so I shall never set foot in the UK again rant over

Generali

worrypants wrote: »

could not agree more one oif the many reasons I left the Uk was the obscene amount of "my" money going on other peoples brats

why oh why should folk with no kids pay for other peoples!! if you choose not to overpopulate this already over populated planet then you should be rewarded for that !!

I will not pay for others kids that they cant afford so I shall never set foot in the UK again rant over

Where did you go that had a suitably anti-child culture? IME, the British hate their kids more than any country on the planet.

Zelie

adr0ck wrote: »

why?

families with children are getting money and so are pensioners

whats wrong with that?

That's nice. But why do I have to pay? I don't mind paying a part of my earnings for social care but why do I not get included when times are tough? Is it only people with children who will be unemployed or stuck in low-paying jobs? Is it only people with children who will have debts? How come none of this extra money was available when I was a kid and my parents and many, many other families managed perfectly well even if we didn't have all the luxuries?

And why should I have to overpay for their kids anyway. Couldn't they look for a second job or something first? As others have said, the timing indicates that a large chunk of it will be spent on Christmas-related costs. If you are suddenly going to bung an extra amount of money at people then do it on a weekly basis - that way the sensible people save it/use it wisely as they would have anyway and the profligate people can't just waste it. And as a further benefit, those paying for it feel less resentful.

Zelie

So the low-wage single person is to live in misery now while paying out extra to keep the middle-wage family content? And all the time they are not allowed to say anything about this being unfair (despite the fact that single people tend to pay out more that couples anyway) because 'it's an investment in their future' which may never be realised? Sorry, but that's messed up thinking.

Far better to spend the money on something else. Crime prevention, assisting with domestic abuse, helping people into work whatever - it would have fare more practical and useful application elsewhere.