Long term tenancy/lease

elljay

Hi all, I've just been watching a programme where it described the French system of renting where you could have say a 10 yr secure tenancy which would mean it would be worth spending money on a rented house as you would have the time to enjoy it and live there in some security. I'd love to negotiate a contract like that with my landlord, I've lived here for 7 yrs and never want to move.

Coincidentally I already have a meeting with the landlord booked for next week as I need to discuss some maintenance issues and thought to raise the subject of a new long term lease. How should I go about arranging this? What are the pitfalls? Is it possible to do it with definite security or are there likely to be get-out clauses for the landlord, as, for example I believe he could now ask me to leave at any time as it is his only property and he might want to live in it- he rents his own home.

I'd be grateful for any advice.. Many thanks, Liz

Notlob

If you had a tenancy agreement fixed for ten years I doubt you would not be having an appointment with your landlord to discuss maintenance issues, it would be your responsibility. The landlord would not be even liable to undertake a gas safety check.

Notlob

elljay

Thanks, I would be quite happy to take responsibility for organising and paying for maintenance if I had a secure long term contract (I don't have gas so that isn't an problem)
The reason I've asked for a meeting is that maintenance issues that were due to be carried out when I moved in still haven't happened - things like water pouring in through windows, ancient boiler that only works when it feels like it and so on - masses of things - despite letters and phone calls. I've paid the landlords well over £30k in rent plus several thousands in house maintenance. I'd resent it less if I didn't always have a fear I could be moved on whenever the landlord wanted. That's why I'd like a secure long term lease. Would it need to be drawn up by a solicitor? as I don't think my landlord would like that or know how to do it so I would have to take the lead. He has said that I can stay here for as long as I like but that's only verbal and if his circumstances change he may decide to come and live here. Who knows?
thanks very much.

Liz

barnaby-bear

elljay wrote: »

Hi all, I've just been watching a programme where it described the French system of renting where you could have say a 10 yr secure tenancy which would mean it would be worth spending money on a rented house as you would have the time to enjoy it and live there in some security. I'd love to negotiate a contract like that with my landlord, I've lived here for 7 yrs and never want to move.

Coincidentally I already have a meeting with the landlord booked for next week as I need to discuss some maintenance issues and thought to raise the subject of a new long term lease. How should I go about arranging this? What are the pitfalls? Is it possible to do it with definite security or are there likely to be get-out clauses for the landlord, as, for example I believe he could now ask me to leave at any time as it is his only property and he might want to live in it- he rents his own home.

I'd be grateful for any advice.. Many thanks, Liz

Long term tenancies seriously devalue properties and the liquidity of the asset plus if there is a mortgage, mortgage lenders restrict the maximum tenancy to 12months usually to protect the value and liquidity of the asset. It's also harder for him to adjust rents to economic conditions and he loses the option to move back in. I can't see why your LL would want to do this - what's in it for him....

N79

elljay wrote: »

Hi all, I've just been watching a programme where it described the French system of renting where you could have say a 10 yr secure tenancy which would mean it would be worth spending money on a rented house as you would have the time to enjoy it and live there in some security. I'd love to negotiate a contract like that with my landlord, I've lived here for 7 yrs and never want to move.

Coincidentally I already have a meeting with the landlord booked for next week as I need to discuss some maintenance issues and thought to raise the subject of a new long term lease. How should I go about arranging this? What are the pitfalls? Is it possible to do it with definite security or are there likely to be get-out clauses for the landlord, as, for example I believe he could now ask me to leave at any time as it is his only property and he might want to live in it- he rents his own home.

I'd be grateful for any advice.. Many thanks, Liz

Long term European Style tenancies place some / many / all (depends on country) repairing obligations on the T and also many do not have a fair wear and tear clause. This is what the LL gets out of it - they do not have to do anything!

It is not possible to do this in the UK at present. You either have an AST for a short period (at most 3 years) or you have an indefinate tenancy with inheritance rights. LLs always have the repairing obligations. The law has been set up this way and there is no way around it. If you go for a longer lease such as a leasehold property then T has many rights about extending the lease indefinately as well.

poppysarah

They missed the point on question time last night. It's not that people are gagging for a "council house" - they just desperately need cheaper rents and security. There's nothing wrong with that either.

elljay

thanks, yes I didn't see 'question time' but security would be great.

My landlord doesn't have a mortgage, it's been in his family for generations but he has no apparent interest in it, sometimes I feel he wouldn't care if it just fell down, as was allowed to happen to another house not far away. However I don't see either why he should bother when he's got a good tenant prepared to spend thousands on maintenance!!

What's in it for him is that his house would be well maintained, after all, just by living in, heating etc a property it keeps it in relatively good condition, and his asset's value would be preserved. And he can rely on the fact that he would receive rent for x no of years with no downtime, having to get new tenants etc. That's how I was thinking of selling the idea to him really, but if, as you say, this can't be done legally then there's no real point in attempting it. It's pretty depressing!

Thanks, Liz

N79

elljay wrote: »

That's how I was thinking of selling the idea to him really, but if, as you say, this can't be done legally then there's no real point in attempting it. It's pretty depressing!

Thanks, Liz

I'm afraid it can not be done as S11 of the LL&T act makes the LL responsible for maintainance irrespective of any tenancy agreement signed. This was introduced to protect stupid Ts from signing tenancy documents that they had not read and ending up with repair obligations. Unfortunately, as with all regulation some flexibility was lost.

elljay

Many thanks. That looks like a wrap then. Such a shame as this little house deserves so much better, having brought up so many families over several hundred years. I'll just have to stick with it and do my best to keep it ticking over and comfortable for myself and try not to think about how much I'm paying the landlord to preserve his asset. Oh well...........

Thanks all for clarifying all of this
Liz

N79

elljay wrote: »

Many thanks. That looks like a wrap then. Such a shame as this little house deserves so much better, having brought up so many families over several hundred years. I'll just have to stick with it and do my best to keep it ticking over and comfortable for myself and try not to think about how much I'm paying the landlord to preserve his asset. Oh well...........

Thanks all for clarifying all of this
Liz

You could ask the LL to sign an assured tenancy of indefinate duration though. If they really do not care about the house then they may be willing to sign - even though it would be a fairly silly move on their part as it will halve the value of the house. You could point out to him that he could serve notice under S20 at the start of the tenancy which would allow him evict you if he or a member of his immediate family wishes to move in (as opposed to your current assured shorthold tenancy where the LL can evict the T without reason using the S21 procedure).

With a bit of luck they will lose the S20 paperwork in a few years giving you a completely secure tenancy!

Maybe worth a try.............

elljay

Thank you again. Could you tell me where I get this paperwork and any guidance notes from? I've done a google but not found what I need. I suspect my landlord knows less about whatever a S20 or S21 is than I do!
From what I've read on here wouldn't this mean he would then have to comply with all of the new rules regarding landlords responsibilities which have come in since I started renting from him? As it would count as a new tenancy. He wouldn't be keen on that. My current contract is called 'List of rules' but I haven't bothered to argue about it as I believe my true legal rights take precedent over any that he might come up with.

Thanks