NI Presbyterian mutual society, Short of funds for withdrawal?

darzip

Toastandbutter wrote: »

Nar, clever with money(!), Darzip

OK guys, I understand you and angry with this whole thing.

You think the church messed up big time and should pick up the tab.

If you had been following this thread for anytime - as opposed to just dropping in with glib comments on what is for many people a major personal crisis of great emotional depth - you would know that in fact most of the PMS members on this thread share your anger and analysis of the church's actions.

NOTE HOW NOBODY IS DEFENDING THE CHURCH AGAINST YOUR CRITICISMS. WE HAVE BEEN THROUGH ALL THE 'NEW' POINTSYOU ARE MAKING MANY TIMES OVER TWO YEARS.

But what does not seem to register with any of you is that the Prime Minister, Chancellor and Treasury Select Committee are all agreed that while the church has been responsible for significant failures in this, the overall responsibility lies with them for their regulatory failure. (It remains to be seen how the church will get out of formal investigations).

I'm not conversing with you any more because you will not even broach this subject.

Neither will you accept that at least £175m but possibly the entire £225m we are expecting is LOAN WHICH THE PMS WILL HAVE TO PAY BACK TO THE TAXPAYER!!!

HELLO!!!!!! - ANYBODY ON PLANET NAR, DARZIP OR 'CLEVER WITH MONEY(!) ?????

THE VAST MAJORITY OF THE MONEY (POSSIBLY ALL OF IT BEING OFFERING TO RESCUE PMS SAVERS IS A LOAN WHICH MUST BE REPAID AT TREASURY RATES.

HELLO!!!!!

Since you are all 'clever with money' and have not lost any money during the recession, I wonder how you would feel if you lost your life savings due to a fatal regulatory failure?

Why should PMS savers be the only savers in the UK to lose money during the UK's banking crisis due to a government regulatory failure?

HELLO!

[T&B clicks his fingers in front of eyes of Darzip, CWM and NAR - will there be a response?].

T&B

T&B, read my post. I've got no problem with the PMS being rescued by the taxpayer. I've read this thread since day one to keep my family informed, I didn't feel the need to post until I read that idiotic post from a Ballymena resident which riled me.

I understand more than most the destress this has caused people who placed their money and faith in the PMS. I'm genuinely sorry if you've lost money, but your response is way over the top and unwarranted.

NAR

He's too busy drooling over his posters of Daniel O'Donnell on his bedroom wall to come back and answer! :rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

expat68

http://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/Big-PMS-savers-asked-to.6594851.jp

Action_Now

Whatever happened to mutuality??? We have fought since the beginning for this (we even passed a vote on it) and now the larger creditors are asked to cover the losses for the smaller savers, along with their own, far from mutual in my opinion. To add insult to injury it appears the executive is planning to blackmail us. It's too incredible for words.

Don't get me wrong, securing the funds from HM Treasury is a fantastic achievement and I am glad they have succeeded in that respect. But the only "fair and just resolution" surely is that everyone is treated equally and the monies are dispensed equally.

From what I understand of the current plan is that someone with £19k will receive 100% and someone with £21k will receive approx £620.

We have fought from the start for the small savers to be treated as equals. Are they now going to fight for us to be treated equally???

expat68

From what I understand of the current plan is that someone with £19k will receive 100% and someone with £21k will receive approx £620.


How did you get to someone with £21K getting £620??

Action_Now

From what I understand of the proposals only those with less than £20k will receive 100% of their money. Those with more will only receive 60%-70% of their loan holding minus the interim payment made already.

Perhaps the Executive are planning to cover everybody's first £20k in shares; I am assuming they are not. Maybe someone can correct me if I am wrong.

I understood that everyone, including Dr. Carson, were aiming for a situation where all savers would be treated equally regardless of the money they had in the PMS.

We had the small savers bearing the brunt of the collapse now it is the larger savers bearing all the cost. Doesn't sound fair to me. (For the record I am a small saver who wants to see right done by all.)

expat68

"About two-thirds of savers will get a very substantial amount back, but we can't be sure if it is 100 per cent," he said.

He suggested that the package could get larger savers/creditors back 80 per cent in the short term but that if they forced a liquidation they would be selling off PMS assets in a bad market and would not get such a good return.

As far as I know this is the only detail on any proposal - possible plan may be that everyone gets first £20,000 back and those with greater than £20,000 will receive a percentage initially with more to follow as value of assets increases but that is just speculation on my part.

BETRAYED

Sunday Sequence 24 October

00 34.00 on.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/console/b00vcwgv/Sunday_Sequence_THE_MORALITY_OF_THE_CUTS

expat68

Assumes NI Exec give another £25m cash and PCI give nothing (Stafford was very slippery on Sunday Sequence - seems no one has asked PCI for more than £1m so not sure what all those people outside church house were doing last summer)
After all shareholders repaid then creditors would get another 60p in the pound on top of the 12p previously received. Put another way someone with £100,000 would receive just under 80% now with more if the future if the asset values recover.

PCI could of course raise a loan with the soon to be Church Palace as security to put a more proportionate share into the pot ?


Cash Govt£ 25,000,000
Loan Govt £ 175,000,000
NI Exec ?? £ 25,000,000
Total cash and loan £ 225,000,000
Shares £ 101,573,000
Creditors £ 204,398,000
First Distribution to creditors-£ 24,301,000
Amount o/s creditors £ 180,097,000
Repay shareholders-£ 101,573,000
Amount remaining for creditors £ 123,427,000
pence in pound £ 0.60
already received £ 0.12
Total to creditors in addition to £20,000 shares £ 0.72

amadan22

"as clear as quantum mechanics" sums it up.when, where, what and by whom?