NI Presbyterian mutual society, Short of funds for withdrawal?

totallyletdown

for anyone thats interested

Dear PMS saver,


A number of savers have mentioned to me that it would be helpful to hear
directly from the Moderator about all that continues to be done to resolve
the problems faced by the Presbyterian Mutual Society. The Church has no
access to the names and addresses of savers and so I am grateful to the
Administrator who has facilitated the mailing of this letter to you at the
expense of the Presbyterian Church.


Since our General Assembly at the beginning of last month, we have continued
to be active in pressing the case for the needs of those who have been
savers with the Presbyterian Mutual Society.


Dr Donald Patton, Dr Donald Watts and I had a very useful meeting with the
First Minister and Mr Jeffrey Donaldson MP on Tuesday 16 June ahead of the
First Minister’s and Deputy First Minister’s meeting with the Prime Minister
the following day. I was impressed by the grasp which both Mr Robinson and
Mr Donaldson had of our situation. The Deputy First Minister was not able
to be present at our meeting but his representative was there, and from his
comments in the media it is clear that he also clearly understood our
plight.


The fact that the two senior ministers in the Executive were totally agreed
on this issue was a point in our favour and helped them to represent our
position with some success. As you know, they had a very good meeting with
the Prime Minister as a result of which a working group was set up under the
chairmanship of Mr Shaun Woodward MP, the Secretary of State for Northern
Ireland.


I believe that the creation of this working group is the best news we have
had since this crisis began, and it indicates that the Government is
prepared to get involved in helping to solve the problem which we all face.
However, we recognise that this is only the first step, and we have sought
to make a number of important points to those in positions of influence.


I am also encouraged that the Chairman of the Treasury Select Committee, Mr
John McFaul MP, who met with Dr Patton in April, has now written to the
Prime Minister asking him to take further action to find a fair and
expedient solution. I also note that the Northern Ireland Assembly’s
Committee for Enterprise, Trade and Investment has welcomed the
establishment of the governmental working group.


We believe that the primary goal of any solution is to see that the totality
of money belonging to those who placed their savings in the PMS is secured,
as well as the credit balances of many congregations, as has happened in
all the other financial institutions which have been caught up in this
crisis.


We also believe that it is important for the Secretary of State to
understand the wider social and political issues which surround this crisis.
The Presbyterian Church in Ireland has provided significant cohesion and
stability in our community in the past, and a successful resolution of our
current crisis will enable our church to continue to make a positive
contribution in a number of important areas. Failure to arrive at a
satisfactory solution will not only have very serious implications for many
individual PMS savers, but will also greatly inhibit our church’s life and
witness in this community.


We hope to have a meeting with the Secretary of State in the next few weeks
to further press the case of savers in the PMS. It is important for you to
know that we are continuing to make contacts with those who can help
formulate a satisfactory solution. Please pray that all these efforts may
prove to be productive. We are hopeful that a plan to resolve this crisis
will be announced by September. We are also aware of the urgency of the
situation and how many PMS savers are under enormous strain. I wish to
remind you that some benevolent funds are available for those who are in
need, and that inquiries about them can be made, in the first instance, by
contacting your minister.


Please be assured of my continuing concern about this situation and my
commitment to doing everything possible to having it resolved.


Yours sincerely,


Rt Rev Dr Stafford Carson
Moderator of the General Assembly

Dr._Who_2

If you didn't receive your letter or part of it is missing contact the Communications Dept., Church House 9032 2284 or e-mail [EMAIL="slynas@presbyterianireland.org"]slynas@presbyterianireland.org[/EMAIL]

I understand that some letters may not arrive until 2morrow morning

Lester_F

Got in this morning and I appreciate the gesture. The man is sincere and is showing some leadership. In short, he is doing his job. It also reflect's poorly on the former moderator; a man without any imagination.

With regard to the Administrator. We are stuck with him. He is doing his job to the letter of the law; but he is doing his job and this is all we can expect. If only the secretary / directors had shown the same professionalism.

There is no chance of the PMS being reconstituted or of a bank buying it. Aside from the toxic debt; most savers including me would withdraw their savings immediately if given the opportunity. I'll not be caught out again.

This situation has changed my whole attitude to money. I used to believe in serious saving, but now I am more likely to spend what I earn and when saving a little to do so with a bank.

Dr._Who_2

Following the PMS Assembly debate the following resolution was agreed "That the General Assembly authorise the General Board to take all appropriate decisions which need ot be made before the next General Assembly in support of savers in the PMS"

The Moderator's letter says "We also believe that it is important for the Secretary of State to understand the wider social and political issues which surround this crisis........failure to arrive at a satisfactory solution will not only have serious implications for many individual PMS savers but will also greatly inhibit our church's life and witness in the community" (Para. 8)

I feel that these two things put together may be sending a signal of some kind that in the event of a possible loss to PMS investors PCI may well look at the issue of funding that loss - this would have enormous implications for PCI for years to come, btu I htink the possibility is there.

HOPE

I think that there is every chance that a bank or other financial institution could buy out the PMS. This is the best chance we have if we are to receive all our savings. I read in one of the newspapers this week that there were two interested parties so it is not out of the question. Some of my friends have put in large sums of money and if the PMS was refloated they say they would be happy to keep it there.

If the regulatory guarantee was in place, I would keep my money in too. Where else are you going to get such a good rate of interest?

ballyblack

Where else are you going to get such a good rate of interest?

That rate of interest was high because the PMS was taking a big reckless risk with the money they had on deposit.

"and it came to pass................."




.

BelfastGran

I know elderly Savers who did even ask and were not interested in how much interest rate was paid, all they were interested in was a place for their savings.


BelfastGran

HOPE

BelfastGran wrote: »

I know elderly Savers who did even ask and were not interested in how much interest rate was paid, all they were interested in was a place for their savings.


BelfastGran

I did not ask either. I did the same as you

no_more_f.w.o

The Moderator's letter is a classic case of too little too late. If it was genuine this letter should have been sent out 9 months ago. It is just a desperate damage limitation exercise.
So many savers have stopped attending church, so many have stopped paying, that the PCI is finally waking up to the situation. Their numbers are falling, they are inextricably linked to the PMS through years of actively encouraging us to put our savings there "for the Church": and are now running scared that they will be legally forced to help bail the situation out.
Don't be fooled by their platitudes - remember PCI knew all about this situation 3 weeks before we did, and that's when they decided their strategy.

Nothing has changed

BETRAYED

ballyblack wrote: »

That rate of interest was high because the PMS was taking a big reckless risk with the money they had on deposit.

"and it came to pass................."

The interest rate or Dividend as it was for shares was good because they had low overheads, only one office, limited staff and interest was paid gross not net like the big banks. Nearly all PMS profits came to us not like Big Banks whose profits all went to their shareholders and ridiculous bonuses to a few staff at the top. (Don't forget who caused the banking crisis...)
PMS were victim of their own success. Too much money being lodged.Funds from site sales by some farmers was one example.
Providing money for housing , even to builders , was not alltogther wrong.
N Ireland still needed houses for people. Housing Executive are not building any more. Housing Assns. are playing a limited role in building.
Moore of Pomeroy was not building big executive houses like South Fork.
Many of his houses I have seen were in the socially deprived protestant areas of N Ireland and could be described as starter homes. One house in my village is 750 square feet. (Now you know I live in a socially deprived area..could explain my bad spelling)
It was partly because funds were withdrawn from PMS that Moore's one company perished...............no more loans for him.
Having said that, no one person should have got a loan of 11% of the total assets of PMS.
Please decide, according to your own circumstances, about what you are going to do with your savings and interest when this matter is resolved in September.
I am going to give a new PMS a second chance.
Committed to Mutual or Co-Operative Societies and Credit Unions.
I like to keep my money in Ireland for benefit of our church and N Ireland people.