Why I'm Giving Up on eBAY and Paypal :-(

Sssssss

name the SOB here and we'll all email him and put some pressure on him, what the F it's gotta do with the seller why you bought a computer for a 3 year old is beyond me, sounds like you're dealing with a real idiot here.

GrahamBM

Many thanks to all for support and encouragement.

To recap, I bought the computer from a seller claiming to be a business using the "buy it now" button. It arrived badly packaged, with bits of plastic rattling around inside the computer itself and dead on arrival. Reported to seller immediately who was less than helpful if not downright rude.

Assuming I was covered with "Paypal Protection" (not to mention the distance selling regulations and sales of goods act 1979) I raised a claim under the "item not as described". Paypal's decision (which they say is final) is that I am responsible for costs of return and must provide them with a tracking number.

Silly me for buying something via eBay using Paypal as my payment processor and expecting it to work!!!

I'm waiting to hear from eBay but naming and shaming the seller does sound like a favourable option at the moment given that it looks like Paypal/eBay are going to make me pay for my naievity :mad:

What shocks me is how companies like Paypal and eBay assume that their terms and conditions override UK law. If they ran a restaurant and put that their terms and conditions included receiving mouse droppings in your food would that still be legal???

Hintza

Remember PayPal is not UK based but based in Luxembourg. Not sure how that affects us but worth bearing in mind.

zzzLazyDaisy

Just a thought - did you pay by credit card? If so you might be able to make a S75 claim and let the credit card company sort it out with the seller.

Also worth reporting the seller to their local trading standards.

robb01

I think more and more people will give up on them too, and Im glad about it

chja

Although you have the right to return (which Paypal/eBay appear to agree with), I'm not sure that the law says that the seller has to bear the cost of the return (although I stand to be corrected).

I know if the thing is damaged you would expect them to, but I'm talking about what is legally correct rather than moraly.

Brooker_Dave

GrahamBM wrote: »

What shocks me is how companies like Paypal and eBay assume that their terms and conditions override UK law. If they ran a restaurant and put that their terms and conditions included receiving mouse droppings in your food would that still be legal???

The sending stuff back by a trackable means is the only way sellers have of getting their stuff back.

If paypal just caved in and refunded everyone, nobody would bother send anything back, and people would take advantage to get stuff for nothing.

If you want a refund, why not stop messing around and just send it back?

CBo

It's always been like that with paypal. If you are dealing with private sellers it's only fair the item is send back so they are satisfied it just doesn't work because it became faulty and of no use to the customer.

RFW

Hintza wrote: »

Remember PayPal is not UK based but based in Luxembourg. Not sure how that affects us but worth bearing in mind.

It makes no difference whatsoever. Such as it is, the 'contract' is between buyer and seller, if they are both in the UK then they are subject to UK law.

Paypal can't refund the return postage as they don't have it, you can only collect that from the seller and Paypal can only refund the money they have been in control of. Just because Paypal aren't paying the return postage doesn't mean you are entitled to it or they are going against the law.
As previously stated, if you want, and all you say is correct, you can insist that seller pays for return before sending it, but as has also been pointed out this may not be the quickest way of getting refunded for the full amount.

GrahamBM

chja wrote: »

Although you have the right to return (which Paypal/eBay appear to agree with), I'm not sure that the law says that the seller has to bear the cost of the return (although I stand to be corrected).

I know if the thing is damaged you would expect them to, but I'm talking about what is legally correct rather than moraly.

Hiya

UK trading law is quite specific about this point. I bought the item from a seller purporting to be trading as a business. Because I used the "buy it now" button the purchase was not considered to be an auction. As a consequence I am legally covered by the Distance Selling Regulations and Sale of Good Act 1979 (as amended).

A useful document which I recommend for those buying and selling on sites like eBay may be found on the OFT site:

http://www.oft.gov.uk/shared_oft/business_leaflets/general/oft698.pdf

Clause 3.57 on page 29 states:

"If the goods are faulty or do not comply with the contract, you [the seller] will have to pay for their return whatever the circumstances."

The problem with Paypal "protection" is as RFW says. Paypal can't deduct money for the cost of the return from the sellers account. It can only suspend money that you have paid for the item and shipping to you. However they effectively side with the seller by forcing you to return the goods and provide a tracking number before they will enable a refund leaving the buyer with the non-protected option of taking legal action against the seller for the return costs. I don't know why Paypal couldn't simply hold the money in stasis for a period of time so that the seller has a commercial imperative to collect their shoddy goods. If the faulty goods aren't collected within, say, 15 days then the money could be refunded to the buyer who could then simply dispose of the faulty item. After all isn't "Paypal Protection" intended to protect the buyer?

This leaves the door wide open for unscrupulous eBay sellers who gamble on the fact that very few buyers will bother to take legal action over £10, and of course they're right. I doubt that will expend any more energy chasing the seller for a tenner. I'll just stop using eBay and Paypal (I find Google Checkout far better actually).

For UK - UK transactions this is an expensive annoyance but people should be more aware of this situation for UK - overseas transactions where this should be a deal breaker and where eBay appear to be doing very little to curb these poor practices amongst their sellers.

I hope this info is of some use to other boarders here!