Asked for Dental NHS Scale and Polish.Told "Go to Hygienist at £25 extra"

boozercruiser

GotToChange wrote: »

Thanks for this ^^^^.
I wonder though, is it a matter of "at the Dentist's discretion" whether or not these treatments are offered? How actually does the patient know what they need - despite knowing (thanks to the article - what they "are" entitled to?

I would have thought that if the Dentist advises you that there is any sort of gum disease then that's it regarding needing further treatment (Scale/Polish/Whatever) under the NHS.

I hope that one of our Dentist friends could give a more informative/difinitive advice on that though?

brook2jack

Read the very long thread above , if you want a scale and polish to eg get rid of stains or a bit of tartar behind your front teeth then you have to pay privately , if you have disease , and this can often only be spotted by a dentist , then you are entitled to nhs treatment.

However we were talking about hours worth of treatment before and being realistic there is no way you will get that amount on time spent on you on a band two £47 treatment.

The list published was wrong in alot of the detail but the general principle is that the nhs will provide the minimum to secure oral health, so dentures are more likely to be offered than bridges and dentists will do perio treatment up to a point. They will not be able to do eg full mouth debridement (cleaning) quadrant by quadrant using local anaesthetic and local antibiotics such as dentomycin. More importantlythey do not have the time and the nhs does not pay for the most important part of treatment which is the advice and education to show you how to control your own periodontal disease and mouth health.

Drifting teeth moving into a space towards the back of the mouth is normally a sign of perio disease. This is something that develops over years and will need intervention for the rest of your life. It's why it's so critical to develop a relationship with a dentist who is well established and will be there to treat you for years to come instead of trusting your health to a different dentist every six months ( the minimum you should attend with gum disease) who will have no idea of yourhistory other than what they read in your notes. Find a "forever" dentist and stick with them then you won't have these issues of trust every time you need something doing.

GotToChange

Thank you ^.
I have read the thread, until my eyes crossed... and I understand what you're saying. ITA that it would be too much to exepect/get what I "need" under the NHS treatment schedule - and besides, my inital worry was that I was being over-quoted/charged privately - I am happy to be seen privately IF I get better and don't have to pay more than I "should" (I know that that's the whole point).
It makes me wonder what happens then to people who do need thorough, extensive - and expensive - perio and simply cannot afford it (at any cost, let alone the £800 I have been quoted - again, for treatment of severe [his words], not mild (as I am told I have). Are they left with it, and have their teeth fall out?

It is not so easy to find a lifetime dentist (which I DID have for 27 years before I moved), the last one I had that I trusted (attended for 4 years regularly) moved herself and went private only - and at that point, private treatment was not in my budget.

brook2jack

You may look at how many dentists after many years in NHS dentistry have, in recent years gone private, and how many nhs practices are staffed by a rapidly changing roster of dentists and draw your own conclusions.

Ultimately you will get the best treatment for you from a dentist that you will see for many years and who gets a good picture of your overall dental health.

If you were looking at implants I presume your finances have changed so would it be possible to investigate the costs of the dentist you saw for four years ? If you trusted and liked her and she's not moved far then at least you would see someone you trust and establish again a trusting relationship. It will be a far more modest investment than the specialist and would give you longer term benefits.

brook2jack

As to the list of nhs treatment printed earlier from the telegraph it is wrong and misleading. It is a copy of the old sdr (statement of dental remuneration) and only applies in Scotland and Northern Ireland where the old contract is still running.

Even there it is misleading as some items eg porcelain crowns with platinum copings (McLean sced crowns) are so old hat no labs make them any more, silicate fillings haven't been available for over 30 plus years and alveolectomies fell out of favour about 20 years ago etc etc etc.

Many of the other proceedures quoted are either rationed eg orthodontics now unavailable to over 18s and under 18s now need to fulfil certain criteria, or are not available in general dental services any more as they are now deemed specialist services eg surgical proceedures such as apicectomies etc., sedation, domicillary services.

However the Telegraph is continuing a grand tradition of misleading and down right wrong reporting of matters dental in the media.

welshdent

What SHOULD happen IMHO is you should be examined. If any disease is noted then you should be informed of the diagnosis/ses and given treatment options. Those treatments should include appropriate NHS options and then private options. NHS options are what is necessary to secure dental health and that is where the dentists judgement comes in

brook2jack

GotToChange wrote: »

Thanks for this ^^^^.
I wonder though, is it a matter of "at the Dentist's discretion" whether or not these treatments are offered? How actually does the patient know what they need - despite knowing (thanks to the article) what they "are" entitled to?

If this article was actually accurate I sincerely hope a dentist would not offer all the treatments!!
Silicate fillings were discontinued 30 years ago as amongst their other faults they tended to turn slightly green and fall out.

Acyrlic faced crowns were discontinued about the same time as the acyrlic peeled away,discoloured and wore easily leaving metal behind.

Silico phosphate fillings had a nasty habit of washing away and were very acid so caused nerves to die off.

Some of the treatments are so old I've never done one even as a student !


Total rubbish ,lazy reporting.

ANNA

Hello,

I am annoyed and aggrieved at the level of service I had from a dentist recently.

My previous dentist was private but has retired. My circumstances have recently changed so I decided to go NHS.

On the recommendation of a friend who was treated by the practice owner/dentist, I booked with a new dental practice that was accepting new NHS patients.

I booked an NHS check-up and was told this costs £16.50.



I had to wait 45 minutes beyond my appointment time in a crowded waiting room. I had filled in the practice form and signed it but the receptionist insisted on reading it out to me (name, dob, address, etc.) for the whole waiting room to hear.



I was finally seen by a dentist who it soon became apparent to me was recently qualified and newly at the practice. I would say that her heart wasn’t in the job. Her assistant was clearly a trainee. The dentist counted up my teeth and fillings. She made a few mistakes and missed many of my tooth-coloured fillings altogether. All the while she chewed gum loudly and in close proximity to my ear. The dentist then offered me x-rays which I declined as I had had x-rays a few months prior. She prodded my gums a bit and said my teeth and gums were alright.


She said she was done. I said I was expecting a scale and polish. She said that’s a separate appointment needed with the hygienist and costs £41. But I insisted as I had taken time off work especially and it was supposed to be part of treatment as the receptionist had said you can discuss all that with the dentist.

She scaled and polished only my front lower teeth inner sides. She told her assistant that this stuff (polish?) splashes everywhere. She did not put anything to cover and protect my clothes (office suit) and afterwards I found bits everywhere (in my hair and nose and on my clothes and face).

She said at the end you’ve only paid £16.50, yet I thought the NHS supplements the patient’s payment.

Can anyone please advise me of my rights as I want to log a complaint.

brook2jack

First port of call is to write to the practice.

Your details should not be disclosed to anyone. Any checking should be done out of earshot.

As to the scale and polish, the dentist said your gums were ok so you are not entitled to one on the nhs as part of your treatment. if you requested one it should be private treatment as there is no clinical need . Nhs appointments for check ups are normally 10 minutes at most including cleaning time so there is never time to do additional treatment at the same appointment. The dentist would have recieved, on average £5 in addition to your £16.50 but again on average 72% of that would have gone on practice costs.



A 45 minute wait is not good but again with so many people to see in a day it just requires one or two to have an emergency and a delay occurs. You should have been told so you could rebook.

The wait is difficult but as so many people have to be seen in a day

welshdent

A Few additional things that stand out to me. Obviously reading your details out is a little unprofessional to say the least. That being said - the waiting time is indeed very frustrating but you said yourself you were used to a private service. We do our best to see everyone to time but the nature of working within the NHS means we have to squeeze more people in and juggle them around. You dont like it but I dont think the dentist does either. A Band 1 treatment IS £16.50 so I am not sure what you were expecting to be supplemented? The NHS does not entitle you to a scale and polish because you expected one. It entitles you to one if you NEED one. But virtue of the fact you said they didnt do very much may indicate there probably wasnt a lot to do and they were just trying to keep you happy.
Regards the X rays ... well they were not to know you had any taken recently. Even if you did they would not have access to them. Even if they did have access they may not feel they are sufficient quality for them to make any sort of diagnosis. The taking of bitewing X rays is very common when seeing a new patient. They can often be the only way to spot early decay and to check the health of existing fillings.
Wjhat makes you think they were newly qualified? Does it really matter that much? It can be very hard to get in to an NHS practice and to be honest, most new patients are seen by the new dentists. By the time they get to a few years in seeing new patients becomes significantly unappealing when you have a stable list of regular patients that you are maintaining well.